DM Help 3.5e - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

DM Help 3.5e

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
mrlkk
Sep 03, 2010 1:30:35 Here is the problem, I will get to explaining later
~My DM Improvises EVERYTHING~

Group
(Lv16 at the time)
Me - Stealth Doppelganger Rogue

Barb/Frenzied Bers Elf-Vampire Tank (Epic HP Kinda OP)

Fighter/Barb Planetouched Backup tank, large damage

Sorcerer Human Epic Spellpower, special power to cast like all 1-5 lv spells, and 1 7,8, and 9 spell per day.

Problem
~I'm not saying he's a bad DM, he is a new one though. BUT this does lead to problems for me mostly, never giving me a chance to shine. Here's one of our normal combat situations

1.)Super Vampire Intitiative goes before the scout/stealth me, I have +5 DEX +2 Imp. initiative

2.)Super duper Vampire tank deals big damage.

3.)I attempt to form a situation where the enemy doesn't see me, or we're flanking, all to do less damage than the everyone else does normally.

4.)Backup tank does a lot of damage

5.)Sorcerer nukes the crap out of the enemy killing it or leaving it to the epitank to destroy.

This strange situation happened because the DM (still not saying he's bad) refuses to plan stuff out and uses the term from the DMG Kick in the door and kill everything, which leaves me the tactical character in the dust. This also leads to situations where the DM completely throws out rules I took so long to read, I know the DM CAN do this my level-headed friend (The Backup Tank) told me to not get so worked up, but this leads to me wasting my time, planning for things that are never gonna happen, and complete destruction of a character that works off of basic rules.

Notes / Conclusion

~I'm not asking for criticism on my part
~I AM asking for ways to better the situations where he completely improvises for me
~As well as ways to better my character all together to better it, I can change up to 6 levels, and must keep 10 levels of rogue, and can change many feats, so that is an option.
`~I want to keep my character stealthy and agile, but be able to fight in these situations, I also have access to many if not all the 3.5 books
#2
t_stalker
Sep 03, 2010 5:39:00 Well, more then likely everyone in your party is overpowered. So a run of the mill rogue will indeed seem less the usefull in this group.

Haev you taken a look here: community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758... ?

10 required levels of rogue will probably leave you little enough to work with though.
What feats do you have atm?
What direction would you like your character to take?
(Stealthy and agile: darkstalker feat should take care of that. What else?)

And for god's sake talk to your DM about how you feel in this party.

Other idea: dump current character, make a Planar Shepard and join the madness.
#3
miarra
Sep 03, 2010 12:49:29 Seconding the post above - talk to the DM.
It sounds like it isn't anything personal, and since he's a new DM, he's probably just having issues giving everyone their time to shine.

Reworking your character is indeed something I'd recommend as well if you feel that's another reason you're being overshadowed. Posting your current build in it's entirety will certainly help others give you more insight for additional build options.

- - -
#4
RyndarLocke
Sep 03, 2010 15:48:27 Ask the DM to let you play a 22 str before level adjustment Wookie Jedi 7 Jedi Knight 6 Jedimaster 3.

What?

It's no more absurd then the frenzied berserker vampire half dragon tarrasque eater.
#5
mrlkk
Sep 03, 2010 22:11:04 Thanks for the comments everyone here are some replies;

1.) I have talked to him, he insists on saying it's more fun, but not about the overpowered because whenever I seem to they kinda hate on me.

2.) I see this comment may come in the future so I'll answer it now, I can't find another group because the only other people who even slightly know how to play DnD in my area is my group, and these other guys who think my group sucked and made their own group which died in 1 session.

3.) I am already in the process of re-working my character, but I must keep the rogue levels because I was a chameleon which ended up not being what I needed, but anyone who has played a chameleon knows you have to keep it a secret so only the DM knew. The reason why I can't tell my companions is that I have already re-worked my character, twice, and I already got some talk from the one of them.

4.) As I said I am already in the process of re-working my character, but you asked about the darkstalker feat, what book is that in?
#6
t_stalker
Sep 05, 2010 6:54:07 (I'm AFB for the moment but ...)

Darkstalker is from Lords of Madness. It basically lets you avoid automatical detection by creatures that have Scent, Blind-Sight, ...

I think you would probably get most fun out of doing a lot of damage. For that I think one of your best options would be Master Thrower.
(A good description from Dearmon on EnWorld:
"Check out the Master Thrower PrC in Complete Warrior. It's actually a kick ass prestige class. You just need Weapon Focus, Point Blank Shot and Precise Shot, which anyone focusing on throwing should take anyway.

The class has some neat tricks in it. Similar to the Exotic Weapon Master, you learn specific 'tricks' you can do with throwing weapons, like the palm throw which allows you to throw two knives/shuriken with each attack. Handy.

It also comes with Evasion, which if you already have it, gets bumped to Improved Evasion.")

Another point you could discuss with you DM: Perhaps you could ask him if you could replace some of your Rogue levels with SwordSage.
It's a stealthy martial class from Tome of Battle. A "4e preview" book that brought martial character nearly to the power of caster classes. Personally I think it's a fairly balanced book that adds a lot of fun to the game, but opinions are very divided on this matter. Give it a read through and compare it with the power levels of your group if your DM isn't convinced.
This book also contains the Blood Storm Blade, another ranged class with a lot of good abilities.
#7
damixmastermike
Sep 07, 2010 13:12:19 What is everyone's ECL in your party? Does everyone's ECL + CL the same?

I know it's not helping but I found Ryndar's post hilarious.
#8
celloshane
Sep 11, 2010 20:06:31 Ways to improve your character are all well and good, but it sounds to me like the problem is you don't want to play quite the same game everyone else is playing. It sounds like you want a game that lets try out different tactics and move your enemies around by being more clever than they are. It sounds like everyone else wants to play a game of "who can hit the hardest". It's not that the two styles can't blend, but it does take some work.
It seems you've already brought this up to the DM and he's unwilling to alter the playstyle to accomodate you. That means you have two basic options available. You can accept that the two styles aren't a perfect blend and look for new ways to make your style work with theirs, or follow the old saying "if you can't beat em, join em." If you want to find ways to scratch your tactical itch in their powergame, it's gonna take a lot more discussion. If you're willing to just change your character so that you can keep up with damage though, it's do-able- you might want to make a new post on the ops boards though. If re-tooling your character is your primary goal, I can point you at some resources; it helps if you share your current build and what options you have on the table though (such as if any books are strictly out, if the DM will let you rebuild/swap levels, ect).
#9
mrlkk
Jan 10, 2011 20:30:15
Ways to improve your character are all well and good, but it sounds to me like the problem is you don't want to play quite the same game everyone else is playing. It sounds like you want a game that lets try out different tactics and move your enemies around by being more clever than they are. It sounds like everyone else wants to play a game of "who can hit the hardest". It's not that the two styles can't blend, but it does take some work.
It seems you've already brought this up to the DM and he's unwilling to alter the playstyle to accomodate you. That means you have two basic options available. You can accept that the two styles aren't a perfect blend and look for new ways to make your style work with theirs, or follow the old saying "if you can't beat em, join em." If you want to find ways to scratch your tactical itch in their powergame, it's gonna take a lot more discussion. If you're willing to just change your character so that you can keep up with damage though, it's do-able- you might want to make a new post on the ops boards though. If re-tooling your character is your primary goal, I can point you at some resources; it helps if you share your current build and what options you have on the table though (such as if any books are strictly out, if the DM will let you rebuild/swap levels, ect).

This is really smart, thank you! We stopped after school started up again, after the first few months we're starting back up, the DM's my best friend so I think he's actually lsitening to me now, so I'll try it again, plus we're more balanced.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 mrlkk Sep 03, 2010 1:30:35	Here is the problem, I will get to explaining later ~My DM Improvises EVERYTHING~ Group (Lv16 at the time) Me - Stealth Doppelganger Rogue Barb/Frenzied Bers Elf-Vampire Tank (Epic HP Kinda OP) Fighter/Barb Planetouched Backup tank, large damage Sorcerer Human Epic Spellpower, special power to cast like all 1-5 lv spells, and 1 7,8, and 9 spell per day. Problem ~I'm not saying he's a bad DM, he is a new one though. BUT this does lead to problems for me mostly, never giving me a chance to shine. Here's one of our normal combat situations 1.)Super Vampire Intitiative goes before the scout/stealth me, I have +5 DEX +2 Imp. initiative 2.)Super duper Vampire tank deals big damage. 3.)I attempt to form a situation where the enemy doesn't see me, or we're flanking, all to do less damage than the everyone else does normally. 4.)Backup tank does a lot of damage 5.)Sorcerer nukes the crap out of the enemy killing it or leaving it to the epitank to destroy. This strange situation happened because the DM (still not saying he's bad) refuses to plan stuff out and uses the term from the DMG Kick in the door and kill everything, which leaves me the tactical character in the dust. This also leads to situations where the DM completely throws out rules I took so long to read, I know the DM CAN do this my level-headed friend (The Backup Tank) told me to not get so worked up, but this leads to me wasting my time, planning for things that are never gonna happen, and complete destruction of a character that works off of basic rules. Notes / Conclusion ~I'm not asking for criticism on my part ~I AM asking for ways to better the situations where he completely improvises for me ~As well as ways to better my character all together to better it, I can change up to 6 levels, and must keep 10 levels of rogue, and can change many feats, so that is an option. `~I want to keep my character stealthy and agile, but be able to fight in these situations, I also have access to many if not all the 3.5 books
#2 t_stalker Sep 03, 2010 5:39:00	Well, more then likely everyone in your party is overpowered. So a run of the mill rogue will indeed seem less the usefull in this group. Haev you taken a look here: community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758... ? 10 required levels of rogue will probably leave you little enough to work with though. What feats do you have atm? What direction would you like your character to take? (Stealthy and agile: darkstalker feat should take care of that. What else?) And for god's sake talk to your DM about how you feel in this party. Other idea: dump current character, make a Planar Shepard and join the madness.
#3 miarra Sep 03, 2010 12:49:29	Seconding the post above - talk to the DM. It sounds like it isn't anything personal, and since he's a new DM, he's probably just having issues giving everyone their time to shine. Reworking your character is indeed something I'd recommend as well if you feel that's another reason you're being overshadowed. Posting your current build in it's entirety will certainly help others give you more insight for additional build options. - - -
#4 RyndarLocke Sep 03, 2010 15:48:27	Ask the DM to let you play a 22 str before level adjustment Wookie Jedi 7 Jedi Knight 6 Jedimaster 3. What? It's no more absurd then the frenzied berserker vampire half dragon tarrasque eater.
#5 mrlkk Sep 03, 2010 22:11:04	Thanks for the comments everyone here are some replies; 1.) I have talked to him, he insists on saying it's more fun, but not about the overpowered because whenever I seem to they kinda hate on me. 2.) I see this comment may come in the future so I'll answer it now, I can't find another group because the only other people who even slightly know how to play DnD in my area is my group, and these other guys who think my group sucked and made their own group which died in 1 session. 3.) I am already in the process of re-working my character, but I must keep the rogue levels because I was a chameleon which ended up not being what I needed, but anyone who has played a chameleon knows you have to keep it a secret so only the DM knew. The reason why I can't tell my companions is that I have already re-worked my character, twice, and I already got some talk from the one of them. 4.) As I said I am already in the process of re-working my character, but you asked about the darkstalker feat, what book is that in?
#6 t_stalker Sep 05, 2010 6:54:07	(I'm AFB for the moment but ...) Darkstalker is from Lords of Madness. It basically lets you avoid automatical detection by creatures that have Scent, Blind-Sight, ... I think you would probably get most fun out of doing a lot of damage. For that I think one of your best options would be Master Thrower. (A good description from Dearmon on EnWorld: "Check out the Master Thrower PrC in Complete Warrior. It's actually a kick ass prestige class. You just need Weapon Focus, Point Blank Shot and Precise Shot, which anyone focusing on throwing should take anyway. The class has some neat tricks in it. Similar to the Exotic Weapon Master, you learn specific 'tricks' you can do with throwing weapons, like the palm throw which allows you to throw two knives/shuriken with each attack. Handy. It also comes with Evasion, which if you already have it, gets bumped to Improved Evasion.") Another point you could discuss with you DM: Perhaps you could ask him if you could replace some of your Rogue levels with SwordSage. It's a stealthy martial class from Tome of Battle. A "4e preview" book that brought martial character nearly to the power of caster classes. Personally I think it's a fairly balanced book that adds a lot of fun to the game, but opinions are very divided on this matter. Give it a read through and compare it with the power levels of your group if your DM isn't convinced. This book also contains the Blood Storm Blade, another ranged class with a lot of good abilities.
#7 damixmastermike Sep 07, 2010 13:12:19	What is everyone's ECL in your party? Does everyone's ECL + CL the same? I know it's not helping but I found Ryndar's post hilarious.
#8 celloshane Sep 11, 2010 20:06:31	Ways to improve your character are all well and good, but it sounds to me like the problem is you don't want to play quite the same game everyone else is playing. It sounds like you want a game that lets try out different tactics and move your enemies around by being more clever than they are. It sounds like everyone else wants to play a game of "who can hit the hardest". It's not that the two styles can't blend, but it does take some work. It seems you've already brought this up to the DM and he's unwilling to alter the playstyle to accomodate you. That means you have two basic options available. You can accept that the two styles aren't a perfect blend and look for new ways to make your style work with theirs, or follow the old saying "if you can't beat em, join em." If you want to find ways to scratch your tactical itch in their powergame, it's gonna take a lot more discussion. If you're willing to just change your character so that you can keep up with damage though, it's do-able- you might want to make a new post on the ops boards though. If re-tooling your character is your primary goal, I can point you at some resources; it helps if you share your current build and what options you have on the table though (such as if any books are strictly out, if the DM will let you rebuild/swap levels, ect).
#9 mrlkk Jan 10, 2011 20:30:15	Ways to improve your character are all well and good, but it sounds to me like the problem is you don't want to play quite the same game everyone else is playing. It sounds like you want a game that lets try out different tactics and move your enemies around by being more clever than they are. It sounds like everyone else wants to play a game of "who can hit the hardest". It's not that the two styles can't blend, but it does take some work. It seems you've already brought this up to the DM and he's unwilling to alter the playstyle to accomodate you. That means you have two basic options available. You can accept that the two styles aren't a perfect blend and look for new ways to make your style work with theirs, or follow the old saying "if you can't beat em, join em." If you want to find ways to scratch your tactical itch in their powergame, it's gonna take a lot more discussion. If you're willing to just change your character so that you can keep up with damage though, it's do-able- you might want to make a new post on the ops boards though. If re-tooling your character is your primary goal, I can point you at some resources; it helps if you share your current build and what options you have on the table though (such as if any books are strictly out, if the DM will let you rebuild/swap levels, ect). This is really smart, thank you! We stopped after school started up again, after the first few months we're starting back up, the DM's my best friend so I think he's actually lsitening to me now, so I'll try it again, plus we're more balanced.