I made a 15th level duskblade. Amongst his feats were empower spell, easy metamagic (empower), arcane thesis (vampire touch) and rapid metamagic. That allows me to arcane a channel empowered vampire touch as a 3rd level spell, dealing 14d6 damage. With his +1 speed weapon that was four attacks per round, most of which were probably going to hit. Consequently, my DM ruled that when I arcane channel and full attack the same target, only the first attack delivers the spell. Have I outsmarted(optimized) myself?
Possibly. It depends on where your groups optimization level is at.
Personally I see "15th level," and "dealing hit point damage," and toss the build into the terribly unoptimizaed pile. But some people seem to think damage matters in 3rd past level 12 for some reason.
Possibly. It depends on where your groups optimization level is at.
Personally I see "15th level," and "dealing hit point damage," and toss the build into the terribly unoptimizaed pile. But some people seem to think damage matters in 3rd past level 12 for some reason.
Because some of us play in campaigns where there are no power-gamers, and as such, damage is what we do, and because some things we fight can't be killed with Magic. (Demilitch ring a bell?)
That said, your DM has changed the feature of the class. the feature specifically states that the spell is delivered on all attacks, no matter the number of separate targets.
BUT: IIRC, Temp HP doesn't stack in 3.5 either (never bothered using Vampiric touch. Shocking Grasp is better. +25d6 at 21, assuming Haste and 5 hits.) so you'd only have the highest amount of Temp HP from a single instance of VT.
Don't listen to the munchkins and play how you want.
it is a primary offensive class.
due to medium armor restriction, it cannot tank, arcane channeling only works on melee weapons. and applies to all attacks. think of a duskblade as a glass cannon.
why not show him how to build pun-pun, or CoDZilla or even, the batman wizard. if he wants to change a feature of a class that relies on it, you picked the wrong feats. you really want power attack and arcane strike. and you want either a greatsword or a guisarme.
assuming +5 weapon
+1 vicious, holy, Sonic adamantine greatsword. (holy is the best alignment enchantment, it works on 80% of your foes minimum, just counting frequent appropriate leveled targets. and almost nothing has protection from sonic damage. [thunderbeasts and guardinals, anything else is 3rd party])
sonic enchantment is same as flaming, change fire to sonic. (it's a semi legal third party weapon enchantment for those who would rather have a loud swoosing slash than a burning one)
you don't want shocking grasp, you want thundering grasp (same thing, but sonic damage)
there is no offical rule that says sonic spells reduce the damage a die step, and the DMG says players can use slightly altered versions of existing spells (changing damage type to be exact. it also works for reserve feats)
the duskblade is supposed to be a glass cannon.
what does a glass cannon do
kill so it doesn't get killed.
want a pokemon example?
Weavile, it can outright 1 round kill anything only to die or be badly wounded the next round.
you're more likely the badly wounded cateogry. (unless you roll for stats and have an extra uber stat to spare)
want a class with the same niche?
the rogue. slay or be slain, has to take proper optimization to be as effective as a duskblade with power attack and arcane strike, but the rogue can do more if optimized properly. but easier to slay.
at 15th level, hit points shouldn't matter.
i'm back to having a second group, (the guy who made the 6d12 katana, only he's not so much on a power trip, his allowed sources are PHB1, PHB2, DMG, And D&Dwiki homebrews case by case, he allows the following genration methods i've seen, 40 point buy, 5d6 remove lowest 2 reroll 1's, and tequilla sunrise dice pool, (30 dice rolled 1 at a time and arranged as pleased, 12 lowest removed, no reroll 1's on the pool though) i used the dice pool, it gave random results as 90% of the group dislikes point buy, (1 player, about 21 years old, claims to be a traditionalist and refused to play if point buy was forced, another guy, a 17 year old newbie who's trialed WoW who references pop culture, likes the chance of high rolls, but doesn't like it when the random number gods hate him. he's often lucky to get 1 16, without DM intervention, i personally use the appropriate dice pool, as it lets me be random, but gives me more control over my stats. and for some reason, the random number goddess loves me when i play his group. i don't seem to need to fudge rolls. sometimes those 6's feel wasted. as i purposely in this group look for builds that suffer from MAD, speifically 3 attributes, occasionally a 4th. especially when you are expected to have at least 2 18's often more. by accident. with the dice, i never have less than 2 18's with this DM. even with the lowest amount of d6's (3)) in random stat gen groups, (traditionalists who exclusively use random stats and shun point buy) i may as well be the dice jesus, when point buy semi-RPGA campagins, i roll slightly below par when playing an elf, especially damage rolls and spot checks. i roll above par with humans, especially spot checks. i have never failed a spot check as a human and i failed them all as an elf. with or without ranks.)
sorry for the ramble
in home games, player characters are supposed to be above the norm, (way above)
RPGA characters are just Badass normals (25-32 points)
Home game characters (w/ random stats) are almost always Badass Abnormals (usually upwards of 2 18's before the other uber stats)
duskblades don't require much optimization to do loads of damage. (especially glass cannon ones)
a properly optimized rogue does more damage but is harder to use, (channeling only works with one weapon, sneak attack works with 2)
damage isn't a problem.
a home game dm knows his players better and works around it.
if vampiric touch is overpowered, he should throw more undead. rather than nerf an important defining class feature. and Temp HP doesn't stack.
I made a 15th level duskblade. Amongst his feats were empower spell, easy metamagic (empower), arcane thesis (vampire touch) and rapid metamagic. That allows me to arcane a channel empowered vampire touch as a 3rd level spell, dealing 14d6 damage. With his +1 speed weapon that was four attacks per round, most of which were probably going to hit. Consequently, my DM ruled that when I arcane channel and full attack the same target, only the first attack delivers the spell. Have I outsmarted(optimized) myself?
You have the right of it. It isn't applied on every hit BUT nor is it applied on only your first. If you attack with your first attack and miss, but hit with your second, it still goes off, since your weapon retains the charge until the end of the round.
Nevertheless, Duskblades have... intrigued character optimizers more than almost any other class in the game, to put it lightly. My personal feel on it's much easier to achieve a very high DPR with that class than almost any other, with possible exception to a dual-wielding Arcane Trickster on a flanked target... though the Duskblade will enjoy a significantly higher + to hit in the later levels, insuring their attacks land. I don't feel a DM is in the wrong, if they add a few houserules that diminish Duskblade's damage.
You're not even counting Arcane Strike, which would add another +4 or +5 to hit on all attacks, and +4d4 or +5d4 to the damage on every hit at the cost of burning a level 4-5 spell as a free action.
Tell him: The party spellcasters force your monsters to make a saving throw or die outright, even at full hit points. The cleric could do it since level 9. The wizard could do it since level 7, albeit your monsters got two rolls. Heck, the wizard was doing it since level 1 for one saving throw roll. It wasn't save or "Die! Die! Die!", but it was save or fall asleep/go unconcious which left them ripe for coup de'grace, and it was against multiple opponents, not just one at a time. You're going to complain my duskblade deals 14d6 damage at level 15?
Your DM doesn't think warriors should get nice things.
Tell him: The party spellcasters force your monsters to make a saving throw or die outright, even at full hit points. The cleric could do it since level 9. The wizard could do it since level 7, albeit your monsters got two rolls. Heck, the wizard was doing it since level 1 for one saving throw roll. It wasn't save or "Die! Die! Die!", but it was save or fall asleep/go unconcious which left them ripe for coup de'grace, and it was against multiple opponents, not just one at a time. You're going to complain my duskblade deals 14d6 damage at level 15?
wizards just love save or die. my Unseen Seer is essentially batman in a waif nazgul look. (he's a male waif that dresses like a nazgul, in fact, his real face is never seen, all that's known about him is that he made a familiar out of his own daughter, whom he created independently through advanced alchemy. an FMA homunculus you can say. his daughter is artificial, but can pass off as natural. and that he is obnoxiously skinny for his size for more nazgul goodness) (always seems to have the tool for the occasion, even if it fails. except evocations and enchantments. he's a diviner who dropped enchantment, find XYZ way to compensate. he doesn't need evocation, if it's not immune to acid, it dies on his turn)
i believe warriors should get nice things.
what does a fighter get, Feats, most people only go for 2 levels, (4 if you really want weapon specialization) 4 levels of figther gets you into most fighter PRCs. but then it's not fighter getting nice things, it's the PRC givign nice things.
so what if rogues have sneak attack, that's not nice enough to compensate for thier frailty, and thier dependancy on XYZ splatbooks to be effective. they have to built to survive to be effective.
both get some nice things if they PRC, but not if they don't.
Nevertheless, Duskblades have... intrigued character optimizers more than almost any other class in the game, to put it lightly.
Mostly because of the interesting side options on them, and a lack of caster reliance. A simple 15th level paladin on a mount with shock trooper and a lance is firing off 1d8+2d6+100 easy without spells, extra feats or even smite. That's without even trying to optimize. It's just really boring to rebuild that same thing over and over again with tiny alterations for the latest splat.
Your DM doesn't think warriors should get nice things.
Tell him: The party spellcasters force your monsters to make a saving throw or die outright, even at full hit points. The cleric could do it since level 9. The wizard could do it since level 7, albeit your monsters got two rolls. Heck, the wizard was doing it since level 1 for one saving throw roll. It wasn't save or "Die! Die! Die!", but it was save or fall asleep/go unconcious which left them ripe for coup de'grace, and it was against multiple opponents, not just one at a time. You're going to complain my duskblade deals 14d6 damage at level 15?
Well, if he's constantly letting NPCs/BBEGs that matter succumb to Save or Die, then that's the symptom of another problem.
Most BBEGs I've encountered/thrown at the party have Saving Throws that are just through the roof. It's really not that hard to do, especially since a level 12-20 BBEG can focus on feats he will need just to make him a single challenging encounter.
Got a Cleric who loves Slay Living? Easily pump up the BBEGs Fort to +25 with the right class/feats/stats. Need a Will Save? Iron Will + Greater Iron Will + a 3 level dip into various prestige classes can net a +10 over whatever his base was. Easily can have +25/+Mid teens/+25 for a level 15 BBEG's saves.
More often than not, PCs in my mid/high level games who uses Save vs. End Encounters are praying I roll a 1, because that's about the only way it's working.
And even then, on special BBEGs, I take "Lucky" from Complete Scoundril, so I can reroll it if that one pops up. ;)
AND EVEN THEN, any one who can cast has Spell Resistance up. And even THEN, they have Spell Turning. And even THEN, they have Deathward Armor. And even THEN... so on and so on.
Well, if he's constantly letting NPCs/BBEGs that matter succumb to Save or Die, then that's the symptom of another problem.
Most BBEGs I've encountered/thrown at the party have Saving Throws that are just through the roof. It's really not that hard to do, especially since a level 12-20 BBEG can focus on feats he will need just to make him a single challenging encounter.
Got a Cleric who loves Slay Living? Easily pump up the BBEGs Fort to +25 with the right class/feats/stats. Need a Will Save? Iron Will + Greater Iron Will + a 3 level dip into various prestige classes can net a +10 over whatever his base was. Easily can have +25/+Mid teens/+25 for a level 15 BBEG's saves.
More often than not, PCs in my mid/high level games who uses Save vs. End Encounters are praying I roll a 1, because that's about the only way it's working.
And even then, on special BBEGs, I take "Lucky" from Complete Scoundril, so I can reroll it if that one pops up. ;)
AND EVEN THEN, any one who can cast has Spell Resistance up. And even THEN, they have Spell Turning. And even THEN, they have Deathward Armor. And even THEN... so on and so on.
So with BBEGs having insanely high saving throws, and not even a Natural 1 is an autofail, have your players asked "Why don't you just ban spellcasters, already" yet?
Well, if he's constantly letting NPCs/BBEGs that matter succumb to Save or Die, then that's the symptom of another problem.
At level 15 it's not Save or Die anymore. It's Die. See Holy Word (with Good Domain and bead of Karma for +5 CL), Maze, Prismatic Wall, and any Power Word spell.
Got a Cleric who loves Slay Living? Easily pump up the BBEGs Fort to +25 with the right class/feats/stats. Need a Will Save? Iron Will + Greater Iron Will + a 3 level dip into various prestige classes can net a +10 over whatever his base was. Easily can have +25/+Mid teens/+25 for a level 15 BBEG's saves.AND EVEN THEN, any one who can cast has Spell Resistance up. And even THEN, they have Spell Turning. And even THEN, they have Deathward Armor. And even THEN... so on and so on.
Also pray your PCs never buy scrolls. Because then they might buy 9th level spells. Nothing ends a fight like Gate or Shapechange....
Oh great. You've spent all your feats and equipment on SR and stuff? Summon, Summon, Polymorph, Self buff and melee with AC.
What did you think casters had to target you with spells to own you? I do hope you're a caster yourself, because you won't have enough cash to get an item of fly. Oh and when the PCs kill your itemed up BBEG they get all his stuff.
So with BBEGs having insanely high saving throws, and not even a Natural 1 is an autofail, have your players asked "Why don't you just ban spellcasters, already" yet?
You do realize there's more spells in the game than ones that instantly kill their target? BBEGs, more often than not, are meant to give 4 players an even match. How's that supposed to happen when 1 spell from any cleric/wizard strikes them down?
I'm not a big fan of the Save or Die mechanic - and I'm glad it's something they got rid of in 4e. If successful vs. BBEGs, it just pretty much takes all the drama out of the moment. If successful vs. PCs... it causes ill-feelings usually, since that's not the way for heroes to die... one-shotted by a spell.
Also keep in mind, I don't use the term BBEG lightly - these are the Szass Tamms, and Manshoons of the campaign. Typically, there's only 1 at any given time, with a few Quasi-BBEGs who report to them. These ones *could* probably be struck down vs. Save or Die, but even at mid level, they're still probably going to have counters to Save or Die, because it would be *stupid* not to, especially since they probably know the party has em, and loves using em.
...
If you want me to list counters to everything you just suggested, I will... in fact, I can probably come up with 3 off the top of my head (including ways that won't even cost the BBEG a turn)... but do note, just because I *know* the counters, doesn't mean I'll always use them.
D&D is about letting the players shine once in awhile, but if every major villian can be struck down within 1 or 2 turns, that's giving them a bit too much power. If they think they can steamroll over the entire world, you have to reign them in with a bit of humble pie.
D&D is about letting the players shine once in awhile, but if every major villian can be struck down within 1 or 2 turns, that's giving them a bit too much power. If they think they can steamroll over the entire world, you have to reign them in with a bit of humble pie.
I agree that steamrolling *everything* is bad. But letting your players drop the BBEG in a round or two every once in a while isn't the end of the world. I chalk it up to inadequate planning on my part, or the luck of the dice.
I agree that steamrolling *everything* is bad. But letting your players drop the BBEG in a round or two every once in a while isn't the end of the world. I chalk it up to inadequate planning on my part, or the luck of the dice.
Agreed - but if that happens, I like it to be because the players planned it out, not because of a lucky/unlucky dice roll.
Last campaign I ran, there was this Bard who loved researching everything. Got kinda laborious at times, but I definitely indulged him. He researched/gathered info on my BBEG as much as he could, and, eventually found out he had a daughter that was being raised in secret from him by an ex-lover (actually made it up on the spot, since I thought it would be cool, and he inspired me to think more in-depth about the character).
Instead of going through my preplanned castle, filled with traps, and fighting him in this chamber I'd planned consisting of ... nightmares... they kidnapped the daughter and did a Jack Bauer, sending him a Magic Mouth and an invitation to scry them. They threatened to kill her if he didn't present himself outside of a small village that evening, alone
Long story short, *he* has to come to them... loses all the benefits of home field advantage and minion support, since he wasn't willing to risk them harming his daughter (Bard had a Bluff of like +17). The battle was over in 2 rounds.
That was one I didn't mind losing quickly - they earned it.
Agreed - but if that happens, I like it to be because the players planned it out, not because of a lucky/unlucky dice roll.
Last campaign I ran, there was this Bard who loved researching everything. Got kinda laborious at times, but I definitely indulged him. He researched/gathered info on my BBEG as much as he could, and, eventually found out he had a daughter that was being raised in secret from him by an ex-lover (actually made it up on the spot, since I thought it would be cool, and he inspired me to think more in-depth about the character).
Instead of going through my preplanned castle, filled with traps, and fighting him in this chamber I'd planned consisting of ... nightmares... they kidnapped the daughter and did a Jack Bauer, sending him a Magic Mouth and an invitation to scry them. They threatened to kill her if he didn't present himself outside of a small village that evening, alone
Long story short, *he* has to come to them... loses all the benefits of home field advantage and minion support, since he wasn't willing to risk them harming his daughter (Bard had a Bluff of like +17). The battle was over in 2 rounds.
That was one I didn't mind losing quickly - they earned it.
when does A BBEG care so much for a daughter he probably didn't want to know about? being a master of villiany requires shedding such weaknesses. the BBEG could say, "That's not my daughter." with a successful uber bluff check. (as DM you could fudge into nat 20)
when does A BBEG care so much for a daughter he probably didn't want to know about? being a master of villiany requires shedding such weaknesses. the BBEG could say, "That's not my daughter." with a successful uber bluff check. (as DM you could fudge into nat 20)
Oh sure, kill player ingenuity. That'll be fun.
when does A BBEG care so much for a daughter he probably didn't want to know about? being a master of villiany requires shedding such weaknesses. the BBEG could say, "That's not my daughter." with a successful uber bluff check. (as DM you could fudge into nat 20)
who says the BBEG was evil? heck, who says the evil BBEG didn't really value his daughter? maybe he has great and evil plans for her...
As for melee at 15, 14d6 seems piddly. Even a cone of cold does more than that. Assuming 4 attacks per round hit, you can easily deal over a hundred damage in a round with polymorph, haste, etc.
Finally, D&D 3.5 is about short skirmishes most of the time. You need to desperately try to make a fight last a minute, and maybe even 5 rounds. The longest battle in which I was a PC was 25 rounds, but most of that was transportation time and the party was separated, each doing his own thing most the time.
The sonic version of Flaming (or Shocking) or freezing is called Screaming, and it's in ghostwalk, and is 3/3.5 legal.
reprinted in MIC
reprinted in MIC
is it d4 or d6 (i pray d6)
Essentially, I make a 'campaign arc' take place at a pace that won't allow the characters to rest. If they take time to rest too much, they risk the chance of failing the campaign. By the time they reach the Big Bad they are depleted in resources, but at the same time the Big Bad doesn't need to resort to anything cheap to defeat them. It becomes a matter of endurance and planning on their part. I whole heartily believe that the thinking of 3.5 being about initiative at later levels is true, if you play the game at 100% resources.
Now I'm not saying have the entire day be a massive battle. No, just have the bulk of the important combat take part of the same day, or enough occurs to prevent easy regaining of spells.
So, in the end if he thinks you're doing too much DPS, he needs to do the following:
- Make more battles/combat take place during the same day.
- Make time important, so that your characters cannot rest for eight hours to recharge spells.
- Make you have to manage your use of your spells better due to the two previously mentioned items.
- Introduce more enemies that have Spell resistance. [Which your touch spells will have to save against.]
- If your character is known in the world, villains should learn to cope with your energy type and start to use protection against it.
This all assumes that everyone else in your party is around the same caliber of character. Now if everyone else is only putting out 60 damage a turn compared to you... Well, your character is just too good compared to theirs. =p
At later levels, a Wizard or Cleric with ample Knowledge (planes) and plane shift can transport the party to a plane where time is very fast compared to their previous plane, then the party can rest all it wants and return with barely a second passing on their previous plane.
Or they can just spend a couple of thousand gold on the blanket from complete mage that reduces the reqquirement of rest to 3 hours.
Anyway, I talked to the DM who, a, he doesn't believe that dealing an extra 14d6 damage on every attack is anything but overpowered, and b, said even this way I'm more powerful than anyone else in the party, although only by a fraction. Persumably no one else in the party is a full caster.
Tangent: I just disallow the Duskblade entirely. It's not like there aren't enough PrCs, feats, gear, and other mechanics to replicate spell channeling in the game already.
Tangent: I just disallow the Duskblade entirely. It's not like there aren't enough PrCs, feats, gear, and other mechanics to replicate spell channeling in the game already.
Out of curiosity, why disallow the duskblade, rather than all of the other kind-of-but-not-really gish classes/PrCs/etc.? As a player, I'd much rather be a duskblade than a wizard/fighter/eldritch knight/abjurant champion because the abilities and spell list are more focused on what I'd want to do.
Out of curiosity, why disallow the duskblade, rather than all of the other kind-of-but-not-really gish classes/PrCs/etc.? As a player, I'd much rather be a duskblade than a wizard/fighter/eldritch knight/abjurant champion because the abilities and spell list are more focused on what I'd want to do.
The list of things not included in my campaign is fairly extensive - it's more like a "what is allowed" list. Smiting Spell (and later, Spellsword) get the job done handily. In a game world where arcane & martial study are difficult to merge properly, the Duskblade is kind of a low-level and easy-to-use boot to the face.
You have the right of it. It isn't applied on every hit BUT nor is it applied on only your first. If you attack with your first attack and miss, but hit with your second, it still goes off, since your weapon retains the charge until the end of the round.
Just so there aren't any misunderstandings: the above poster is wrong. At level 13+ a Duskblade's stored spell affects each target he hits within one round.
At 13th level, the duskblade’s arcane channeling class
feature (PH2 20) says “you can cast any touch spell you
know as part of a full attack action, and the spell affects
each target you hit in melee combat that round.” If you hit
the same creature more than once during the full attack
action, does the spell affect it each time you hit?
No. The spell affects each target only once.
If a 13th-level duskblade (PH2 20) applied a metamagic
feat to the touch spell he channeled through his weapon,
would the feat’s effect apply to each successful attack made
as part of the full attack action?
Yes. Unless somehow indicated otherwise by the spell or
effect, the full effect of the spell (including metamagic feats
and any other effects) would apply to each and every target hit
as part of the full attack action.
But how are you getting 14d6 out of an empowered Vampiric Touch? At 15th level that's normally 7d6 + empower makes (increased by 1/2) 10d6. Does that include weapon damage? ~oops I missed a few Feats, Is that where the extra 4d6 comes from?
But how are you getting 14d6 out of an empowered Vampiric Touch? At 15th level that's normally 7d6 + empower makes (increased by 1/2) 10d6. Does that include weapon damage? ~oops I missed a few Feats, Is that where the extra 4d6 comes from?
Partially my fault actually. Arcane thesis give you +2 CL to your chosen spell, so that increases it to 8d6. Then empowered makes it 12d6. I corrected my mistake in the opening post.
"I cast hold person then chop off his head!"
Cant you do somthing like be a lvl 13 duskblade and a lvl 17 wizard and infuse a orb of ultimate destruction to infuse 40d6 into all of your attacks and focus on getting lots of attacks... duel weilding.
No. Arcane Channel specifies "Duskblade Spells."
i.e. spells gained through advancement in the duskblade class.
No. Arcane Channel specifies "Duskblade Spells."
i.e. spells gained through advancement in the duskblade class.
Class Features:
Spellcasting – Able to cast Spontaneous Intelligence-based Arcane spell from the Duskblade spell list (see page 180). At 1st level, a Duskblade knows two 0th level
spells and two 1st level spells. Each subsequent levels, a Duskblade leans one spell of any level he/she can cast. Starting at 5th level (and every odd-numbered
level afterwards), a Duskblade may replace one Known spell with another of the same level and they both must two levels below the highest the Duskblade is
able to cast).
Arcane Attunement – Able to cast the following as Spell-like Abilities: Dancing Lights, Detect Magic, Flare, Ghost Sound, & Read Magic. Castable 3 +
Intelligence modifier times per day total. Does not count against the normal spell per day.
Armored Mage (xxx) – A Duskblade ignores the Arcane Failure chance of certain types of armors when casting Duskblade spells:
1st – Light Armor & Light Shields
4th – Medium Armor
7th – Heavy Shields
Arcane Channeling (standard attack) – As a Standard Attack, a Duskblade may cast a ‘touch attack’ spell and deliver the spell through a melee weapon attack. This
action does not provoke an Attack of Opportunity. The spell’s casting time must be no more than 1 Standard Action.
Quick Cast, N/day – The Duskblade may reduce the cast time of N spells per day to 1 Swift Action. The spell must have a casting time of 1 Standard Action.
Arcane Channeling (full attack) – As a Full Round Attack, a Duskblade may cast a ‘touch attack’ spell and deliver the spell through every attack that is part of a
Full Round Attack. This action does not provoke an Attack of Opportunity. The spell’s casting time must be no more than 1 Standard Action. The ‘touch
attack’ spell’s duration is reduced down to 1 round when used this way.
Spell Power +N – If a Duskblade has injured an opponent in melee the current battle, he/she receives a +N bonus on checks to overcome the Spell Resistance of
that creature for the duration of the encounter.
Where does it say that?
((( And come to think of it quick spell specifies as a swift action and the quicken spell feat alows for a free action
and i gues depending on your dm you can cast a swift spell and a quicken spell along with your regular actions for the round... 2 fast spells in a turn is nice this i am assuming ))))
No. Arcane Channel specifies "Duskblade Spells."
i.e. spells gained through advancement in the duskblade class.
Sorry sir, but you are wrong.
Cant you do somthing like be a lvl 13 duskblade and a lvl 17 wizard
True, but by then you're level 30, and the full level wizard can Gate in 62+ HD creatures, or toss out 14d4 negative levels with Epic spells.
Let us not speak of the Artificer and her staff of miracles, powered entirely by action points instead of charges.
Armored Mage (xxx) – A Duskblade ignores the Arcane Failure chance of certain types of armors when casting Duskblade spells:
1st – Light Armor & Light Shields
4th – Medium Armor
7th – Heavy Shields
Quick Cast, N/day – The Duskblade may reduce the cast time of N spells per day to 1 Swift Action. The spell must have a casting time of 1 Standard Action.
((( And come to think of it quick spell specifies as a swift action and the quicken spell feat alows for a free action and i gues depending on your dm you can cast a swift spell and a quicken spell along with your regular actions for the round... 2 fast spells in a turn is nice this i am assuming ))))
OK, I guess I was assuming Armored Mage's restriction (Bolded) held for the rest. My bad.
Regarding that blurb on the bottom, you are limited to 1 Swift Action per turn.
and remember, you are a Spontaneous(sp?) spellcaster. Any Metamagic Feat increases the time spent casting the spell, IIRC, so Quicken Spell is useless to you, unless cast through a Rod.
And, two fast spells could be nice, but, quite frankly, you're already a killing machine.
And, did you REALLY need to copy everything?
EDIT: and no, you still cannot channel the Orb Spells. Touch of Chaos(Exemplars of Evil) on the other hand...
Also, remember, you CAN channel Touch range spells gained as a Wizard, but ASF DOES apply for those spells. (see above.)
Cant you do somthing like be a lvl 13 duskblade and a lvl 17 wizard and infuse a orb of ultimate destruction to infuse 40d6 into all of your attacks
This is why as a DM I think twice before allowing a duskblade in a gestalt game.
This is why as a DM I think twice before allowing a duskblade in a gestalt game.
Remember, this isn't a legal combo. The spell's Range must be "touch"
Remember, this isn't a legal combo. The spell's Range must be "touch"
Yes but even without that, mixing the duskblade with 9th level spell casting capabilties does leave a lot of options can easily become broken. The factotum is another class I'm weary about allowing in a gestalt game.
Yes but even without that, mixing the duskblade with 9th level spell casting capabilties does leave a lot of options can easily become broken. The factotum is another class I'm weary about allowing in a gestalt game.
Ahh, the Factotum.
Yeah, there's no way that'd work in gestalt.
OTOH, CLERIC//DRUID is perfectly balanced. (See what I'm getting at here?:P )
Side comments:
My group reads the description of full channel as "the spell discharges in all forms" after 1 round, not, you no longer have the spell at hand, so that probably is more balanced, NMW, than putting 4 9th level touch spells with normal max duration.
Hence the reason I use Shocking Grasp.
But, having found that I can take the time to research any spell of level 4 or lower and get in on my list in the epic campaign, at one spell level higher...:D
Also, can't find much in the way of high level Touch spells in the SRD. (is there anywhere that has spells by range?)
EDIT: also, anyone with 9th level spellcasting and the "Improved Combat Casting" feat is pretty much winning anyway.
No AoO for casting, yes please. (My duskblade took this feat as his Epic feat. Really, any true Gish should have it eventually.)
Dont like that? Cant play evil characters you say? then simply be a favored soul who is favored by nerul but wants nothing to do with nerul but uses his powers to further his own goals thats how you play evil characters in good campaigns... this reminds me of a story about a jedi....
Dont like that? Cant play evil characters you say? then simply be a favored soul who is favored by nerul but wants nothing to do with nerul but uses his powers to further his own goals thats how you play evil characters in good campaigns... this reminds me of a story about a jedi....
My favorite spell to single channel is "Touch of Chaos," a spell with both Chaotic and Evil descriptors. Not Technically a Duskblade spell, but, because they weren't allowd to go outside of Core for the DB spells, I'm allowed any 5th level or lower S/W spell from WotC sourcebooks, provided I can make an arguement why I would use it.
For ToC, I just showed it to my DM. And he said Yes.
can you technicly abuse this in another fasion... say you grab a stick and use it as a woupon and go duskblade/healing cleric then do full attack action arcane channeling with healing spells and wack the crap out of your allies with the twig of epic healling... will that work? mmmm it would hurt soo goood...
Hmm...
If you take a high enough healing power.
I'd recommend just getting a Sap and using that. They're cheap, and they do subdual.
You can even recreate the Healing Shiv, this way.
Hmm...
I just might try this. (Already got Inflict Critical through research. 4d8+20 per hit? Nice.)
what are your stats... was constitution not a big thing because you could just heal yourself with vampiric touch?
Did you only focus on int and str? do you get your int to 15 and leave it there not worrying about raising your spell DC?... cause the duskblade does get save for die spells...
whats a good point buy system set up if stats for the duskblade
we dont need strength for dmg just getting the hit
you have a cleric duskblade?
Are there any marticular magical items that a duskblade should get... what did you spend your money on.
I was planning on making a duskblade in my upcomming campaign with some friends
Should i duel-weild to gain a better benefit from my full attack arcane channeling or use a sheild?
Throw some of your opinions at me
whats a good point buy system set up if stats for the duskblade
we dont need strength for dmg just getting the hit
you have a cleric duskblade?
Are there any marticular magical items that a duskblade should get... what did you spend your money on.
Should i duel-weild to gain a better benefit from my full attack arcane channeling or use a sheild?
Throw some of your opinions at me
This campaign has some houserules for Character Creation, as we are playing "ourselves" @ ECL22: Roll for stats, and the Stat order determined by everyone else will show where to put your stats. Con was my highest, followed by INT.
I ended up, after stats and bonuses, with Str/Dex/Con/Int of 16, Wis 12, CHA 10. I don't remember much beyond this, as it was almost 2 years ago. (No-xp campaign, so still ECL22)
I use a Halberd, because I hate how reach works in 3.5. Dual-Wield doesn't work that way, as you can only enhance one weapon at a time. (I think.)
I don't use my SoD/SoS spells much. I tend to stick to Damage and Enervation. (By Fenrir, I LOVE that spell.)
Remember, you use DEX for your ranged touch attacks.
In my campaign, Spontaneous casters are great, because they know their entire spell list. And, because of the "no non-core" constraint that Duskblade was created under, I get to argue for the inclusion of other S/W spells from other books. I suggest "Touch of Chaos" from Exemplars of Evil, If you are nongood and nonlawful.
Feats I recommend: IMPROVED CRITICAL(Chosen Weapon.),
Dimension Jaunt(reserve feat. Complete Arcane, I think) (Utility purposes only, as it's a Standard Action for the movement. This one always annoys my DM when he forgets about it. Need to have the Dimension Door spell before you can take it.)
Arcane Thesis: +2 to CL, -1 to metamagic level is VERY useful, as you don't have all that High to go.
Chain Spell. sure, it's +3 to Spell Level, but it comes in handy.
Power Attack. I didn't take this feat. And i've been regretting it ever since.
the first epic feat you get will be Improved Combat Casting. There are no other options. Nothing compares in usefulness for a Duskblade. you stop provoking AoO for casting spells. Period. Full Stop.
You're a Melee oriented caster. you will want to cast spells in melee at times, this will help.
For Armor, get Mithril Fullplate. It's the best armor you can cast your spells in, AFAIK. You will have a 0% ASF so long as you have the Armored Casting(Medium) feature.
Boots of Speed are great.
A keen weapon, if you don't have ImpCrit. Ghosttouch is always a plus, and any damage adding enhancement.
Also, once you've hit 20, if your DM doesn't approve an Epic Progression for Duskblade, you can't go wrong with something similar to EK. (I went Fighter, but wish I had improved my caster level.)
There is a really good Duskblade guide out there, do a yahoo search for "Duskblade guide." I lost the link.
BTW if you want to break the duskblade class... Go duskblade and prestige into enlightend fist and get the ability to put your ranged attacks into your touch attacks and use polor ray on your full attack action and focus on getting lots of extra attacks in varius ways... by the time your 20 with a caster lvl of 18 you will be able to do like 1000 dmg every full attack action with polor ray
thanks
BTW if you want to break the duskblade class... Go duskblade and prestige into enlightend fist and get the ability to put your ranged attacks into your touch attacks and use polor ray on your full attack action and focus on getting lots of extra attacks in varius ways... by the time your 20 with a caster lvl of 18 you will be able to do like 1000 dmg every full attack action with polor ray
We're a bit past that...(no-xp, remember) and it's Polar Ray.
I should know, I wrote my thesis on it.
My Arcane Thesis. (22d6, half cold half negative energy? yes please!)(I have the Lord of the Uttercold feat. all cold damaging spells are half cold, half negative.:D )
We're a bit past that...(no-xp, remember) and it's Polar Ray.
I should know, I wrote my thesis on it.
My Arcane Thesis. (22d6, half cold half negative energy? yes please!)(I have the Lord of the Uttercold feat. all cold damaging spells are half cold, half negative.:D )
Since the correction police decided to make an appearance. Check for red bold on the corrections to your work. Then remember to not nit-pick please.
We're a bit past that...(no-xp, remember) and it's Polar Ray.
I should know, I wrote my thesis on it.
My Arcane Thesis. (22d6, half cold, half negative energy? Yes please!)(I have the Lord of the Uttercold feat. All cold damaging spells are half cold, half negative.:D )
:P