To counter the traditional response of "that's what my character would do", there are other things your character could do. For one, think about the possibilities if you left the PC alive and manipulated them into helping you quest for more magic items. In that light, you should let them live for now in return for using them to increase your power over the long term. Your character can focus on gathering info on possible magic item stashes, which your party then raids. You need them to help you raid the stashes for magic items, they benefit by getting adventure hooks and keeping a (smaller) portion of the loot.
Even if you don't follow this idea exactly, you should think a long time (and discuss it alone with your DM before hand) before you potentially ruin the campaign for everyone. I think most people in the forum will agree with that.
Killing characters is sometimes a good things, but often your fellow players don't like it. (Would you like it if another PC killed your character?)
Now, SteelMirror says some good things right there, I suggest you go with that, as the only other idea I can hand you might not make you favoured with the other players and characters either.
SteelMirror has some better suggestions. Listen to him.
I am a 12th level rouge currently in a city overtaken by warforge. I wish to kill one of the member of my party by killing them while they sleep. They are a neurtal good character, but I have a dagger that was given to me by the warforged king that is intelligent and it will get stronger with the more magical items I feed it. I want to kill this character so I can take his stuff to buff the dagger, but I currently have 2 other members in the party I am traveling with. The first is a warlock who is neutral evil, so I doubt he will care that much that I killed the player, but the other is a lawful good cleric, who would not like that I killed a member of the party at all. I don't want to kill the cleric, because he is a friend of my character's in the game. I need an excuse to tell him when he finds out that I killed the other player. Can anyone help me think of something, or is there something else that I could do with the player after I kill him to cover my tracks? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
If your goal if to buff the dagger why not kill an NPC? Better yet steal things and don't kill anyone. Even better buy a bunch of really cheap magic items and proceed to used buff dagger to kill monsters and earn all of the gold spent and then some.
The best way to get around the cleric who will not like this is to simply not get caught.
Consider buying scrolls of teleport, or invisability for immediatly after you do the deed. Make sure not to leave any evidence, and possibly try to frame someone else.
If the cleric doesn't know it was you, you don't have to try to lie to them.
I agree with others here, don't do it.
I know that there are situations where a person is getting revenge on another player or the other guy is an epic jerk but character killing is usually the least productive or effective way of handling the situation
If it is supposedly something this character would do you can be pretty much guaranteed that the other player will make up a character who has an in game justification for killing your character. Just be prepared for the player of the dead character will make a pc specifically just to kill your character.
Although the whole not killing thing other people are suggesting also work. Sadly the game I'm in we have an official kill chart to keep score since it happens so often, therefore I lack the ability to tell you how to handle the situation diplomatically without being a hypocrite.
Oh we thought it would be different with 4th edition, a new start and all that. However the frail wizard thought he could have dibs on the book just because that was "his thing" and I had a pointy weapon that disagreed (backed only by my improved sneak attack, my daily, and an action point to use my encounter as well), oh he died.
Don't fight what is in your blood, just know that yours can be spilt too.
As i don't permit PCs to Kill each other for any reason.
I would make you gain a derangement, have the guilt drive you mad, you will start yelling in your sleep about how you killed your teammate and how you plan to kill the rest of them when your weapon needs a power boost....MUHAHAAAHAHA
Sorry got of topic...
Ohh yeah your looking for a reason to do it...UMMMM..... well there is no reason unless the guy threatens your life or purposely hurts you (self defense does not count!!!), So don't do it man, Steal, bribe feed it potions, feed it equipment that's gathering mold at the bottom of your bag of holding... just dont kill your teammates.
I've always been curious, what alignment do you think a group of PCs would be that are totally loyal to each other but would lie,cheat and murder anyone else to achieve their goals? The PCs are best buds with each other, love, care and protect each other but anyone outside their group is expendable. What alignment would that be? LE?
Human
Here I must enter my disdain. In my Many Years of playing i have met many players and have played games with every possible personality. You sir, are the worst type. Your a self centered person who is only there to play a game for his own entertainment. you have totally missed the point of role-playing. In the name of Gary I rip your membership card in half. Go play a player vs player game somewhere but D&D is not it. Your goal at the table is not to work against the other players. Try chess with a blind man my friend. That or karate with toddlers. It seems to fulfill your needs.
I think I like you.
Human
Hmm this is true, many humans I've seen are like this. I still think LE fits well.
If I kill someone who was expecting me to watch their back, then other party members will kill me in order to protect themselves. There may be no honor among thieves, but everybody has to sleep. Even Hitler was loyal to his bodyguards.
To the OP:
I don't think you need to worry as much about the cleric as you do about the wizard. After all, he has the same self centered alignment that you do, and as soon as he realizes that you killed a party member for his magic items, then the wizard has to realize that he may be next. Don't be surprised if he decides to eliminate the threat first.
I would.
MrJake
Hmm this is true, many humans I've seen are like this. I still think LE fits well.
And that is why the god of the humans is LE.
MrJake
I am a 12th level rouge currently in a city overtaken by warforge. I wish to kill one of the member of my party by killing them while they sleep. They are a neurtal good character, but I have a dagger that was given to me by the warforged king that is intelligent and it will get stronger with the more magical items I feed it. I want to kill this character so I can take his stuff to buff the dagger, but I currently have 2 other members in the party I am traveling with. The first is a warlock who is neutral evil, so I doubt he will care that much that I killed the player, but the other is a lawful good cleric, who would not like that I killed a member of the party at all. I don't want to kill the cleric, because he is a friend of my character's in the game. I need an excuse to tell him when he finds out that I killed the other player. Can anyone help me think of something, or is there something else that I could do with the player after I kill him to cover my tracks? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
Only 1 post by this guy, safe to assume it's just troll post.
I would like to say that people know not to kill other party members, unprovoked, since one of my own characters was killed simularly; I can't of a good reason to do it unless he has attacked you before.
Only 1 post by this guy, safe to assume it's just troll post.
No it's not.
No it's not.
Ok I should have said, " In my experience, it's safe to assume it's a troll post."
Phorden came home from school yesterday with this idea weighing on his mind. He'd been lurking around the forums for some time, and finally decided to register so he could seek advice on his problem. Since then, he hasn't had a chance to log back in.
I mean, it's been less than 24 hours since he first posted. I can see your point if we're looking at 2, 3, 4 days out. But it's less than a day.
That said, if you think he's a troll, that's fine. My suggestion is that you report the post to the moderators, rather than tossing around accusations. There's two reasons for that:
1) if he is a troll (the mods can check, for example, to see if this is a sock puppet account), the mods can take actions to remove him from the community.
2) In the past at least, the mods have considered "he's a troll" statements to be baiting, which would needlessly get the person making the accusation in trouble.
Finally, the question itself - when you boil it down - is legit. It gets asked on a regular basis: how do I handle PvP combat without angering the other players?
All in all, I just don't see the stack of evidence you do, and even if I did calling it out like that is generally counter-productive and has the potential to get the wrong person in trouble with the moderators.
Which god would that be?
Zarus. Portfolio = humanity, domination, perfection. From Races of Destiny.
Massively, massively bad idea, especially if not everyone is on the same page with the idea. PvP never ends well unless it's friendly and agreed to beforehand. Even PvP that consists of a single attack doesn't go well, in my experience - I've had a character attacked by a party member twice, both times the attack was the first I'd heard of it, and both times it accomplished nothing other than making it incredibly difficult for me to justify why my character was even still around these people(Both were part of or shortly after a new character introduction), as well as making me resentful of the players themselves. Especially since the second instance was in a dungeon and the damage from it meant that I nearly died in a later fight.
And that's just damaging someone's character, let alone actually killing them.
If I were your DM I absolutely wouldn't allow it, if I were the other player I'd quit or if I were feeling particularly petty make a character designed precisely to destroy yours, use it for said purpose and then quit.
Hell, it can have repercussions outside the people involved - The first time a character of mine was attacked by another it was handled so poorly and railroaded so badly someone *else* quit in disgust over it being allowed - My character that was already up and didn't even sleep to begin with(trance, not sleep) was suddenly alone in the seperate tent he suddenly had asleep so the rogue could attack him in his sleep with a poisoned dagger. The natural 20 I rolled on that fortitude save was the best 'screw you' roll ever and I remember it fondly to this day. And yeah, someone else quit over it, I nearly quit myself and the campaign fell apart a few sessions later.
Really, just don't do it. There are other, better ways to get magic items that will not get people incredibly cheesed off at you.
Zarus. Portfolio = humanity, domination, perfection. From Races of Destiny.
Ayup.
DnD's version of Adam wasn't that much of a nice guy to anyone but his wife and offspring (and even that can be contested), but he got a better deal in the end.
I am a 12th level rouge currently in a city overtaken by warforge. I wish to kill one of the member of my party by killing them while they sleep. They are a neurtal good character, but I have a dagger that was given to me by the warforged king that is intelligent and it will get stronger with the more magical items I feed it. I want to kill this character so I can take his stuff to buff the dagger, but I currently have 2 other members in the party I am traveling with. The first is a warlock who is neutral evil, so I doubt he will care that much that I killed the player, but the other is a lawful good cleric, who would not like that I killed a member of the party at all. I don't want to kill the cleric, because he is a friend of my character's in the game. I need an excuse to tell him when he finds out that I killed the other player. Can anyone help me think of something, or is there something else that I could do with the player after I kill him to cover my tracks? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
What SteelMirror said. Killing other player characters, particularly in an unprovoked manner, is likely to have extremely negative consequences for both your PC and your game in the long run. I have seen people get into fistfights over this sort of behavior, and that's not an exaggeration.
Never, but never, kill another PC unless it's explicitly already part of the game--and even then, think twice. One of the primary mistakes that gets made in evil campaigns, aside from playing in one in the first place, is that D&D players tend to equate "evil" with "sociopathic and murderous". Logically, however, evil characters have friends and associates for the same reasons good characters do: because you're stronger as a group than any one of you would be alone. Think long and hard before you destroy another PC (and any sense of trust between the players, ever again) simply because you haven't gotten past "evil = killing everyone lulz
!" PS: Why is the LG cleric friends--or even friendly toward--your evil PC?
You ought to be able to distinguish between the player and the character. The fact that you wish to kill the player suggests that you've got a couple of loose screws in your head.
Show
:D
So, my advice, like so many others' is not to kill them at all. Find another way to attain the items. I mean you are a rogue so sneaking in on him while he is sleeping and stealing them is possible and then you can always knock him out if he wakes up. Or charm him into giving them to you in trade for something you have or for some service you could provide like picking a lock for him or protecting him or something. Say somethign along the lines of "if you give me (said items) then I will use the dagger that has been improved by (said items) to protect you". Or better yet tell him he can use it from time to time. Killing him isn't really your best option. The more player characters there are the better off your campaign will be (for survival factor anyway).
I would kill him and hide the body along with all his gear and act like you dont know where he is just like everyone else.
Or I would try to convince the other evil guy in private that the other person should be killed and dont do it yourself, but try to reap the reward.
Unlike others, I will answer the OP's question instead of acting like the OP asked whether or not PvP combat is a good or bad thing.
To be perfectly fair, given the OP's post, it seems perfectly reasonable to surmise that he hadn't considered that this course of action might be disruptive to the table and end up causing out-of-game hard feelings that would jeopardize any future gaming he might want to do with his group. I don't think people were out-of-line for pointing that out and trying to dissuade him from this course of action.
In other words, it might not have been the question he was asking, but it was absolutely the answer he needed to hear.
And watch out for that warlock, he may blackmail you or try to take your so very awesome dagger if he finds out about it, maybe you should kill him on top everyone else.
Also if your DM tries to stop you from doing this, sneak into his room at night and stab him with your awesome dagger, then take his power as DM to give yourself all the magic Items for us.
A lot of people on these forums are going to tell you what your planning is wrong, so you may need to kill them in their sleep as well, with that awsome dagger, and take their magic Items and FEED THEM TO ME!!!
YOU FOOL YOU ARE NOTHING WITHOUT ME, NOW FIND ME MORE MAGIC ITEMS SO MY or I mean our, YES OUR POWER CAN GROW!!!
-Sincerely, Your Dagger.
If the DM agrees, you could tell the other characters about your plan to "steal" the powers of your fellow characters. Perhaps at the point, you could lay out your case why you think it is a good idea for your dagger to have whatever powers you want it to. Narrow it down to a list of six. If your story is good enough, the DM could give you a bonus to your diplomacy check. If the check succeeds and the character agrees then you roll a d6 and whatever result you get gets you one of those desired powers. The character keeps his abilities but now your dagger has one that it share.
You have a cleric, so you roll a d10 for damage and immediately you cleric heals that damage. No harm to the other character and your dagger now has a most awesome power. If you still want more repeat the entire process until you get what you want.
This will give you what you want and will be a very fun way to roleplay. At least that is M2C.
I say you don't have to kill the other character to get what you want... Perhaps at the point, you could lay out your case why you think it is a good idea for your dagger to have whatever powers you want it to.
So your idea is for the OP to acquire whatever powers he wants at no cost to anyone?
No, but seriously I think this is a bad idea. If you're coming here for an excuse for killing a party member, then I suspect that this isn't a pvp campaign, and you just want to kill people, get their magic items, then kill their new character and get an infinite magic item loop right up until your DM bans you from the game.
I worded that wrong. What I meant was that you could lay out the reasons you want those specific powers. The other way would make the dagger a game breaker.
If the item becomes a game breaker, then as DM I would inform the player that the dagger has grown in significant power to influence the players every action, thus making the character wish he hadn't been so greedy (it is sentient after all). Also, the powers of the universe would not allow such a powerful item to exist and would constantly send proxies to capture said dagger. Problem fixed.
I read the OP just before I went to bed and didn't reread it this morning. I thought his companion was a warforged and thus wanted to take some of his companions powers not the powers of his companions items. In light of this, disallow most of what I said. I made a mistake. Not the first and probable not the last. Killing a companion to take his stuff to feed the dagger is just a bad idea.
Sounds like it's a recipe for self-destruction, even for the OP.
For a game in which anything is supposed to be possible, a lot of the dm's seem to really oppose the idea of player killing. I would say if you can somehow frame the other player and make it seem like he was working for the enemy and you discovered it, thus justifying the killing.
The problem that you seem to be overlooking is that this sort of thing can break up a gaming group. If my player assassinates the king of the land in his sleep, there are no out of game consequences because the king was an NPC. A PC, on the other hand, is run by a player that may have invested a lot of time and emotion into it. So when one player has his character kill another player's character the second player is likely to be justifiably ******. Once this sort of thing starts up it could quite easily end up with at least one player leaving the group.
In this sort of situation I, as a DM, would likely provide a timely ambush on the party before the offending character could carry out his deed. Depending on how much of a problem the character/player has been up until this point, I might be inclined to see to it that the offending PC doesn't make it through the battle, and then take the player off to the side and explain that it's time to shape up or ship out. In the long run this sort of player is usually disruptive and bad for a group.
Unless of course player killing is explicitly allowed in the group. In that case they can do as they please.
Mccowen,
I worded that wrong. What I meant was that you could lay out the reasons you want those specific powers. The other way would make the dagger a game breaker.
I hoped that was the case.
Handing out additional powers for the dagger as "treasure" is fine, but effecively just granting a player six new magic items would be a bit of a problem.Does anybody else think feeding the dagger is a really bad idea in the first place?
I don't know what you could possibly mean. Everyone knows that greedy, cruel sentient magic items have only the good of the wielder at heart. I mean, look at what happened to that nice Gollum fellow!
Here I must enter my disdain. In my Many Years of playing i have met many players and have played games with every possible personality. You sir, are the worst type. Your a self centered person who is only there to play a game for his own entertainment. you have totally missed the point of role-playing. In the name of Gary I rip your membership card in half. Go play a player vs player game somewhere but D&D is not it. Your goal at the table is not to work against the other players. Try chess with a blind man my friend. That or karate with toddlers. It seems to fulfill your needs.
Presume much?
The first is a warlock who is neutral evil, so I doubt he will care that much that I killed the player, but the other is a lawful good cleric, who would not like that I killed a member of the party at all. I don't want to kill the cleric, because he is a friend of my character's in the game. I need an excuse to tell him when he finds out that I killed the other player.
That being said and if everyone agreed beforehand, the warlock probably would care since if you were willing to kill a fellow party member he now sees you as a threat and will probably kill you first chance he gets. And the LG cleric might now have a duty to kill your character, even if he is a friend. So make it look like some one else did it or at least make it look like you acted in self defense.
I want to kill this character so I can take his stuff to buff the dagger, but I currently have 2 other members in the party I am traveling with. The first is a warlock who is neutral evil, so I doubt he will care that much that I killed the player, but the other is a lawful good cleric, who would not like that I killed a member of the party at all. I don't want to kill the cleric, because he is a friend of my character's in the game. .
Neutral Evil, doesnt mean they won't care. And it would have to be an exceptional excuse, because all the other characters should be thinking "am i next?"
Killing players is never a good thing, because murder is bad, and in some states and countries is punishable by death.
That sounds like something one of my English teachers would have said...
Very creepy.
Anyway, I actually did this once. The other characters promptly unfair-advantaged me, permanently removing me from the game. I was left with atrociously high amounts of angst and an evening with nothing to do.
The circumstances were that the character I killed was Evil and I felt my character wasn't getting his fair share of the treasure (what else is a paladin of Bahamut supposed to do?)
Frankly, now, no one can join our group if there is any hint of PvP.
Ian