Help with Alchemical Ingredients - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Help with Alchemical Ingredients

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
baelthorn
Sep 03, 2012 13:31:01 Ahoy there,

i'm playing an alchemist in my pathfinder group and i really need help with some roleplaying. Can someone tell me some Ingredients (Real or Fantasy) that alchemists use to mix bombs and extracts? I've just played D&D for a few month so i don't know much about it.
#2
Langrishe
Sep 04, 2012 8:38:20 Powdered dragon bones can be used to make bombs when combined with red lotus seeds. You need to wrap a small amount into a dry animal skin or a thick parchment papaer. Use string as a fuse or bark from a try if you don't have any string. Some DM's will vary the blast range and damage based on the colour of the dragon whose bones you are using and you need to remember to dry out the lotus seeds for at least a season otherwise the powdered dragon bones will become damp and unusable. Depending on your character level and the amount of dragon bones you have will no doubt effect construction.
#3
Centauri
Sep 05, 2012 11:17:03 Oh, man, they'd use anything. Every plant, body part, metal, dung, fluid, rock or anything might find its way into a concoction. Sometimes the means of obtaining the ingredient was of more significance than the ingredient itself. Of course, very little of it did anything useful, and almost none of it did what they thought, but in a fantasy game you have more leeway, and you're not restricted to mundane substances.

You basically can't go wrong. Just make your ingredients as outlandish as possible and you might come close to how outlandish the ingredients of "real" alchemists were.
#4
mellored
Sep 07, 2012 10:51:10 A basic black powder recipe has 75% potassium nitrate (salt peter), 15% charcoal, and 10% sulfur.

Not sure it works in D&D world, but there ya go.
#5
Mad_Jack
Sep 07, 2012 21:31:34
   Iron oxide (rust) and aluminum are the basic ingredients of thermite, often with a bit of magnesium to start the reaction. In an alchemical sense, since it burns through anything, it would be used as a purifier or a catalyst. It's probably also one of the components of an everburning torch as a representative of elemental fire.

Sympathetic magic is the metaphysical idea that one thing can influence another similar thing - "as above, so below", "like calls to like", etc...
(This is why ancient shamans wore the skins of animals and ancient hunters ate the hearts of their prey, to gain what they percieved as the qualities of that animal - the swiftness of a deer, the strength of a bear, the courage of a lion. It's also why in the old days the Web spell required you to swallow a live spider.)
What substances or items or animal parts posess the mystical qualities you're trying to instill in your formula?

   The heart of a lion would give courage, while the heart of a boar would give stubborness or resolve, and probably a bonus to Fortitude or saving throws. The heart of a dragon is a font of magical power, and wouldn't be used for anything but a major working.
   A dragon's scale might be an ingredient in any sort of potion involving protection, resistance or shielding.
Feathers or whole wings from various birds or creatures could be used for a flying potion or item that gives flight. Althernately, the wings of a bat or butterfly might be used for something involving silent movement.
Diamonds can represent invulnerability or clarity.
Silver is the metal that represents purity.
A spider's eight eyes or an insect's multifaceted eyes might be used to give enhanced vision but could also be used in alchemical mixtures designed to give a bonus to diplomacy since they would allow you to see things from multiple points of view...

As Centauri mentioned, sometimes the items are empowered by the means through which they were acquired or the obstacles required to be overcome in order to get them. Mistletoe, though powerful on it's own, is best harvested with a golden sickle under the light of a full moon. A Native American wearing an eagle feather may have had it given to him, but it is much more meaningful if they took it upon themselves to climb up and get it. Even the glass of water that Eddie Murphy had to carry across the room in The Golden Child was just a glass of water until he drank it, and then it became wisdom and the key to unlocking his future.

#6
Neutronium_Dragon
Sep 10, 2012 7:27:27 > It's also why in the old days the Web spell required you
> to swallow a live spider.

I'm pretty sure that was Spider Climb, not Web.
#7
Mad_Jack
Sep 10, 2012 21:13:03
What were the components for Web? I thought they included a spider, too.
#8
Krusk
Sep 11, 2012 15:15:13
3.5 web needs a bit of spider web.

Just harvest stuff from any monster you fight. Eyes, tounges, fingernails, hair, scales, beaks, claws, tails, and teeth are a good starting point. Anytime your DM makes an effort to describe a plant, harvest some.
#9
Neutronium_Dragon
Sep 15, 2012 18:56:04 If you want a somewhat-thematic simple set of things to work with, look up the Ultima CRPG (single player, not UO) series' magic system, since the reagents associated with spells can easily be reinterpreted to alchemy. Two of the latter games in the series, in particular (The Serpent Isle; Pagan) greatly expanded on the default eight (in some cases, for actual in-game alchemical purposes).

Return to Krondor was another game with a good built-in alchemy system that allowed free-mixing of reagents to produce various potions/oils/etc.

In both cases, a specific reagent was associated with a specific type of effect, and the effect of a product that resulted from combining a specific set of them could (at least in general terms) be surmised by what their individual effects were.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 baelthorn Sep 03, 2012 13:31:01	Ahoy there, i'm playing an alchemist in my pathfinder group and i really need help with some roleplaying. Can someone tell me some Ingredients (Real or Fantasy) that alchemists use to mix bombs and extracts? I've just played D&D for a few month so i don't know much about it.
#2 Langrishe Sep 04, 2012 8:38:20	Powdered dragon bones can be used to make bombs when combined with red lotus seeds. You need to wrap a small amount into a dry animal skin or a thick parchment papaer. Use string as a fuse or bark from a try if you don't have any string. Some DM's will vary the blast range and damage based on the colour of the dragon whose bones you are using and you need to remember to dry out the lotus seeds for at least a season otherwise the powdered dragon bones will become damp and unusable. Depending on your character level and the amount of dragon bones you have will no doubt effect construction.
#3 Centauri Sep 05, 2012 11:17:03	Oh, man, they'd use anything. Every plant, body part, metal, dung, fluid, rock or anything might find its way into a concoction. Sometimes the means of obtaining the ingredient was of more significance than the ingredient itself. Of course, very little of it did anything useful, and almost none of it did what they thought, but in a fantasy game you have more leeway, and you're not restricted to mundane substances. You basically can't go wrong. Just make your ingredients as outlandish as possible and you might come close to how outlandish the ingredients of "real" alchemists were.
#4 mellored Sep 07, 2012 10:51:10	A basic black powder recipe has 75% potassium nitrate (salt peter), 15% charcoal, and 10% sulfur. Not sure it works in D&D world, but there ya go.
#5 Mad_Jack Sep 07, 2012 21:31:34	Iron oxide (rust) and aluminum are the basic ingredients of thermite, often with a bit of magnesium to start the reaction. In an alchemical sense, since it burns through anything, it would be used as a purifier or a catalyst. It's probably also one of the components of an everburning torch as a representative of elemental fire. Sympathetic magic is the metaphysical idea that one thing can influence another similar thing - "as above, so below", "like calls to like", etc... (This is why ancient shamans wore the skins of animals and ancient hunters ate the hearts of their prey, to gain what they percieved as the qualities of that animal - the swiftness of a deer, the strength of a bear, the courage of a lion. It's also why in the old days the Web spell required you to swallow a live spider.) What substances or items or animal parts posess the mystical qualities you're trying to instill in your formula? The heart of a lion would give courage, while the heart of a boar would give stubborness or resolve, and probably a bonus to Fortitude or saving throws. The heart of a dragon is a font of magical power, and wouldn't be used for anything but a major working. A dragon's scale might be an ingredient in any sort of potion involving protection, resistance or shielding. Feathers or whole wings from various birds or creatures could be used for a flying potion or item that gives flight. Althernately, the wings of a bat or butterfly might be used for something involving silent movement. Diamonds can represent invulnerability or clarity. Silver is the metal that represents purity. A spider's eight eyes or an insect's multifaceted eyes might be used to give enhanced vision but could also be used in alchemical mixtures designed to give a bonus to diplomacy since they would allow you to see things from multiple points of view... As Centauri mentioned, sometimes the items are empowered by the means through which they were acquired or the obstacles required to be overcome in order to get them. Mistletoe, though powerful on it's own, is best harvested with a golden sickle under the light of a full moon. A Native American wearing an eagle feather may have had it given to him, but it is much more meaningful if they took it upon themselves to climb up and get it. Even the glass of water that Eddie Murphy had to carry across the room in The Golden Child was just a glass of water until he drank it, and then it became wisdom and the key to unlocking his future.
#6 Neutronium_Dragon Sep 10, 2012 7:27:27	> It's also why in the old days the Web spell required you > to swallow a live spider. I'm pretty sure that was Spider Climb, not Web.
#7 Mad_Jack Sep 10, 2012 21:13:03	What were the components for Web? I thought they included a spider, too.
#8 Krusk Sep 11, 2012 15:15:13	3.5 web needs a bit of spider web. Just harvest stuff from any monster you fight. Eyes, tounges, fingernails, hair, scales, beaks, claws, tails, and teeth are a good starting point. Anytime your DM makes an effort to describe a plant, harvest some.
#9 Neutronium_Dragon Sep 15, 2012 18:56:04	If you want a somewhat-thematic simple set of things to work with, look up the Ultima CRPG (single player, not UO) series' magic system, since the reagents associated with spells can easily be reinterpreted to alchemy. Two of the latter games in the series, in particular (The Serpent Isle; Pagan) greatly expanded on the default eight (in some cases, for actual in-game alchemical purposes). Return to Krondor was another game with a good built-in alchemy system that allowed free-mixing of reagents to produce various potions/oils/etc. In both cases, a specific reagent was associated with a specific type of effect, and the effect of a product that resulted from combining a specific set of them could (at least in general terms) be surmised by what their individual effects were.