So, I have recently started playing D&D with a new group of players. There is one player who I am starting to think my personality is clashing with. Certainly, his personality is clashing with me.
There are a number of factors. Some of these factors are small. For example, some of the rules he wants to impliment (loss of exp when you die) would ruin the fun of the game for me. Of course, our DM has worked past this problem (and found a happy middle ground). But the problem does not end there...
My next problem is just with the way the person acts in general. I am probably a little long winded. I like to explain things in detail. Its a personality tick. This player regularly snaps at me as I try to answer a question, or explain a rule, because he feels I am explaining it in too much detail. Of course, sometimes it turns out that my explanation is useful, because as it turned out at todays session, what he thought I was saying, and what he thought the rest of the group thought, was wrong. Added explenation actually did clarify matters. Still, I find the way he regularly snaps at me to be rude.
This is made even worse when I question him about any ability he uses. For example, his character (a fighter) somehow has the ability to shift 2 squares with a shift action instead of 1. I don't know how. I think the ability is neat. I asked him how he was able to do it. He didn't really respond. In fact, two times I asked and he simply ignored me. The third time he snapped at me telling me that he couldn't tell me, and that I should simply stop asking him questions.
This sort of attitude is starting to bleed into his in character play as well, and this is wear I feel the camels back is starting to break. In the last game we played a combination of two in character events has resulted in me not knowing how to really role-play my character except by hating his.
First, our group comes up against a town overun by cultists. During a number of encounters with these cultists, all of whom were townspeople, every member in the group killed a number of these cultists/townspeople. The first encounter was a little different. Instead of being a fight, it was a skill challenge where our group wracked up successes with athletics checks, acrobatics checks, and the like. The reasoning was that the assailents were too week for the fight to really warrent an actual combat encounter, and that it would take less time if we simply modeled the combat as a skill challenge. I really liked the encounter. However, our characters don't see levels or tags hovering over peoples heads. From an in character point of view, this encounter was no different than any other combat encounter we faced in that town, despite the fact that from a metagaming point of view we obviously realized that our assailents were weaker. In any case, when one of the townspeople chose to rush me with an axe, I decided in character that I would kill him. He rushed at me with an axe! In character, he was no different than anyone else we fought or killed (even if OOC I could metagame to realize that he was a weaker assailent).
In any case, after the quest was finished, and the evil cultists were killed, it sort of became clear that many of those who faught us during that skill challenge encounter only did so in fear of the cultists (who probably would have sacrificed them if they did not follow the cultists orders). Most of the town was very greatful for what we did. One member was pissed at my character because my character killed his brother (who was the villager that rushed at me with an ax). Next thing I know this player's character is lecturing me in character, telling me how I need to make restitutions because I killed this man's brother (never mind that 2 seconds ago my character was the one noticing that the villagers were going to have a poor harvest as a result of the problem with the cultists, and he was trying to offer them about 100gp worth of items so that they could fund their town with food for the poor harvest months), and how as a powerful warrior it was a cowardly act of me to kill this villager. Of course, this character killed plenty of villagers himself. He just killed them during combat encounters instead of the skill challenge... which from an in character point of view was really not that different.
Anyways, this already miffed me a bit, but it wasn't that big a deal. Then comes the moment that has really pissed me off. First, my character risks his life to save this players character in an encounter that takes place in the sewers. Then, this character informs me that we are taking another member of the party to a group of druids so that they can seperate him from an evil symbiot that accidentally got attached to him during the course of the cultist adventure. I am informed that in the process, our party member might die. My character, coming from a tribal culture that believes that spirit companions can help give a person the strength to achieve resurection after death instead of the utter loss of a soul, captures a cat. The goal is to give this cat to our fellow party member to be his spirit companion. Its not quite the same as the dinosours that my character's culture employs, but my character has an int of 8. The idea was to role-play good intentions, but a lack of real smarts. As my character is trying to expalin to this character (not the player/character I am having a problem with, but another group member), without giving away that he might soon die when we try and seperate him from the simbiot (because the entire group is afraid that the symbiot is affecting his mind, and that he might react poorly if he finds out that the only way to seperate him from the symbiot might result in his death), that it is very important that he take good care of the cat, the player/character I am having an issue with threatens my characters life out of the blue. Basically he says shut it, lets get on with things, or I am going to kill you. I asked him if that is actually what he said IC, he said yes. Keep in mind, just the night before I saved this characters life.
In character, and out of character, I feel that this player is being really rude. Maybe I am being overly sensative, but its starting to really detract from my ability to enjoy this new group (that otherwise I have really enjoyed playing with). I have no idea how to deal with the sitution, but if it goes on I am not really going to enjoy playing with this group anymore. First of all, I don't really like inter-party conflict (and it now exists between our group. I mean, if I was to go back into the situations in the sewers after this character threatened my characters life for what I percieved to be no reason, I would never have bothered trying to save his life. The second he went down I would have cut my losses, turned tail, and run, leaving him to die). Second of all, I don't really like people being rude to me when I ask them questions, or when I answer the questions of the rest of the group. If this was you dealing with this situation, how would you deal with it?
When responding, please keep in mind that this is simply my perception of events. As anoying and frustrating as I am starting to find this player, chances are, from his perception I am probably equally anoying and frustrating. I fully realize that our personalities are clashing. Problem is, I don't know how to approach the subject without it resulting in a fight, and making the situation worse. And, if the problem doesn't go away, I am going to have to leave this group, because this is really detracting from my ability to enjoy the game.
Also keep in mind, while I am assuming that other members in the group have picked up on the tension, I have not voiced my issues to anyone. For the last two or three games I have felt tension between me and this player, slowly getting worse each session (todays sessions was by far the worst instance of such tension), but I have not activly really voiced the problem I am having. I don't really know how to go about voicing this problem without potentially just making the problem worse.
What should I do?
Is the only inter-party conflict between your PC and his? If not than PC v PC tension is a part of this group.
Do your two PCs fill the same basic role in the party? He might see your PC as competition, and has decided to make life miserable for both you and your PC.
I have found PCs conflicting can be fun, as long as the conflict is kept in character. In one game I played my PC and another hated each other, our backgrounds were way to different for the PCs to ever have more than a grudging respect for each other. Lots of in character arguments and one duel (to first blood) happened between us. It worked because neither of us carried the problems into real life.
As for advice, if I was dealing with the crap you are I would speek with the player and DM about how I felt. Either the problem would get solved or it would be obvious to me that they did not really care about my concerns. If the later then I would walk, I cannot see any reason to play with a group that does not quickly and decisively remedy problems between players.
Is the only inter-party conflict between your PC and his? If not than PC v PC tension is a part of this group.
Do your two PCs fill the same basic role in the party? He might see your PC as competition, and has decided to make life miserable for both you and your PC.
I have found PCs conflicting can be fun, as long as the conflict is kept in character. In one game I played my PC and another hated each other, our backgrounds were way to different for the PCs to ever have more than a grudging respect for each other. Lots of in character arguments and one duel (to first blood) happened between us. It worked because neither of us carried the problems into real life.
As for advice, if I was dealing with the crap you are I would speek with the player and DM about how I felt. Either the problem would get solved or it would be obvious to me that they did not really care about my concerns. If the later then I would walk, I cannot see any reason to play with a group that does not quickly and decisively remedy problems between players.
The only inter-party conflict so far has been between my PC and his.
No, our two PCs do not fill the same basic role in the party.
Yes, I might enjoy such conflict if not for the fact that there is no good IC reason for it. In fact, it seems to me that the presense of this conflict is very against the nature of our characters and their backstories. It really doesn't make much sense. Honestly, I think this is more of an OOC thing bleeding into IC than anything else.
As for me walking, its a real possibility right now. I mean, I would rather not, but I really didn't enjoy the last session we played at all... But, I'm really not intrested in making anyones life unpleasent. I am sort of thinking it might be better for everyone if I just make up an excuse, and stop playing with this group. It would suck, because I really like the DMs DMing style, and I really like the rest of the group, but I don't really want to cause problems. How would you broach this issue to the DM and the player who (I feel) is casuing it (I'm sure he feels I am the cause) without causing any extra unpleasentness for anyone?
So, I have recently started playing D&D with a new group of players. There is one player who I am starting to think my personality is clashing with. Certainly, his personality is clashing with me.
There are a number of small factors. Some of these factors are small. For example, some of the rules he wants to impliment (loss of exp when you die) would ruin the fun of the game for me. Of course, our DM has worked past this problem (and found a happy middle ground). But the problem does not end there...
My next problem is just with the way the person acts in general. I am probably a little long winded. I like to explain things in detail. Its a personality tick. This player regularly snaps at me as I try to answer a question, or explain a rule, because he feels I am explaining it in too much detail. Of course, sometimes it turns out that my explanation is useful, because as it turned out at todays session, what he thought I was saying, and what he thought the rest of the group thought, was wrong. Added explenation actually did clarify matters. Still, I find the way he regularly snaps at me to be rude.
player conflicts have been apart of this game for awhile: we all have our ticks: if he cant accept it is his fault- not yours. try to explain that to him.
This is made even worse when I question him about any ability he uses. For example, his character (a fighter) somehow has the ability to shift 2 squares with a shift action instead of 1. I don't know how. I think the ability is neat. I asked him how he was able to do it. He didn't really respond. In fact, two times I asked and he simply ignored me. The third time he snapped at me telling me that he couldn't tell me, and that I should simply stop asking him questions.
i would ask the dm to clairify if he is cheating: if he wont tell you the ability he is using then he has no choice but to tell the dm the ability. if he wants it to be like puling teeth then let it be like that.
This sort of attitude is starting to bleed into his in character play as well, and this is wear I feel the camels back is starting to break. In the last game we played a combination of two in character events has resulted in me not knowing how to really role-play my character except by hating his.
First, our group comes up against a town overun by cultists. During a number of encounters with these cultists, all of whom were townspeople, every member in the group killed a number of these cultists/townspeople. The first encounter was a little different. Instead of being a fight, it was a skill challenge where our group wracked up successes with athletics checks, acrobatics checks, and the like. The reasoning was that the assailents were too week for the fight to really warrent an actual combat encounter, and that it would take less time if we simply modeled the combat as a skill challenge. I really liked the encounter. However, our characters don't see levels or tags hovering over peoples heads. From an in character point of view, this encounter was no different than any other combat encounter we faced in that town, despite the fact that from a metagaming point of view we obviously realized that our assailents were weaker. In any case, when one of the townspeople chose to rush me with an axe, I decided in character that I would kill him. He rushed at me with an axe! In character, he was no different than anyone else we fought or killed (even if OOC I could metagame to realize that he was a weaker assailent).
In any case, after the quest was finished, and the evil cultists were killed, it sort of became clear that many of those who faught us during that skill challenge encounter only did so in fear of the cultists (who probably would have sacrificed them if they did not follow the cultists orders). Most of the town was very greatful for what we did. One member was pissed at my character because my character killed his brother (who was the villager that rushed at me with an ax). Next thing I know this player's character is lecturing me in character, telling me how I need to make restitutions because I killed this man's brother (never mind that 2 seconds ago my character was the one noticing that the villagers were going to have a poor harvest as a result of the problem with the cultists, and he was trying to offer them about 100gp worth of items so that they could fund their town with food for the poor harvest months), and how as a powerful warrior it was a cowardly act of me to kill this villager. Of course, this character killed plenty of villagers himself. He just killed them during combat encounters instead of the skill challenge... which from an in character point of view was really not that different.
one, i would have told chicken **** next time try to prevent from killing themselves and everyone like a fighter would and quit poping lectures like a wizard.if someone is trying to kill you you have every right to defend yourself.
two, setting different and skill based events should be handle in accordance to scenio: no one can come of a quest smelling like a rose every time: sometime bloodshed is needed. try explaining that to him IC (and knowing me: OOC with a few choice words...
Anyways, this already miffed me a bit, but it wasn't that big a deal. Then comes the moment that has really pissed me off. First, my character risks his life to save this players character in an encounter that takes place in the sewers. Then, this character informs me that we are taking another member of the party to a group of druids so that they can seperate him from an evil symbiot that accidentally got attached to him during the course of the cultist adventure. I am informed that in the process, our party member might die. My character, coming from a tribal culture that believes that spirit companions can help give a person the strength to achieve resurection after death instead of the utter loss of a soul, captures a cat. The goal is to give this cat to our fellow party member to be his spirit companion. Its not quite the same as the dinosours that my character's cultures employ, but my character has an int of 8. The idea was to role-play good intentions, but a lack of real smarts. As my character is trying to expalin to this character (not the player/character I am having a problem with, but another group member), without giving away that he might soon die when we try and seperate him from the simbiot (because the entire group is afraid that the symbiot is affecting his mind, and that he might react poorly if he finds out that the only way to seperate him from the symbiot might result in his death), that it is very important that he take good care of the cat, the player/character I am having an issue with threatens my characters life out of the blue. Basically he says shut it, lets get on with things, or I am going to kill you. I asked him if that is actually what he said IC, he said yes. Keep in mind, just the night before I saved this characters life.
let them do it: when to the character dies yours can say "i told you so" : cant argue with brick walls but if you wish threaten the characters: stating that you will not let them harm him with their foolishiness.
In character, and out of character, this player is being really rude. Its starting to really detract from my ability to enjoy this new group (who otherwise I have really enjoyed playing with). I have no idea how to deal with the sitution, but if it goes on I am not really going to enjoy playing with this group anymore. First of all, I don't really like inter-party conflict. Second of all, I don't really like people being rude to me when I ask them questions. If this was you dealing with this situation, how would you deal with it?
the game is suppose the be fun: i get on all the characters nerves too but it is in my nature to be always helpful by giving advice but it pisses this one guy off i play with in which case he takes way too long with things (i actually am beginning to respect his method quite well: it reminds me of my rogue-playing ways...oh wait he plays stealth....).
try to find common ground with him and see where you two can go from there if not then just kill character and be done with it: you may get cussed out but you will feel ALOT better about showing him that your character may have 8 int but you it is well enough to shut him up for good!
When responding, please keep in mind that this is simply my perception of events. As anoying and frustrating as I am starting to find this player, chances are, from his perception I am probably equally anoying and frustrating. I fully realize that our personalities are clashing. Problem is, I don't know how to approach the subject without it resulting in a fight. And, if the problem doesn't go away, I am going to have to leave this group, because this is detracting from my ability to enjoy the game.
Also keep in mind, while I am assuming that other members in the group have picked up on the tension, I have not voiced my issues to anyone. For the last two or three games I have felt tension between me and this player, slowly getting worse each session (todays sessions was by far the worst instance of such tension), but I have not activly really voiced the problem I am having. I don't really know how to go about voicing this problem without potentially just making the problem worse.
What should I do?
well i have given most of mine but here is some jewels of thought: try asking the other payers if he is always that way; he may just be a jerk 24/7. if the other players get mad well it means that they are people you should play with.
talk to the others and see their points first before going to him; in which case he is a jerk just tell him how you feel as adult- calm and quietly. you never till you take that first step.
Hrm. I thought at first that you might be coming across as pushy. But then, he's not willing to explain how he's bending rules? A bit of a red flag there.
My advice is to ask the other players, and see if you come across as overbearing to them as well. You might seem like you are trying to play the game for others, even if you don't mean to. Consider giving an explantion, knowing that you will take a while if a longer explantion is needed. Consider asking others to explain simply when the ruling is clear and a quicker explantion is better.
I would seriously ask the DM about the shifty business, but frame the question not as an accusation, but if you wanna learn the rules better to be clear on what your PC can and cannot do. Also ask about the combat thing, as his PC also merrily kicked the snot out of these peasants. See where the DM stands on this issue.
However, I do reccomend confronting this player as well! It's just not going to be possible to play if he's threatening your character for OoC things. Ask him how you can make the game enjoyable for the both of you. Unfortunately, you may have to move on if the group picks him over you. I cannot reccomend staying and losing friends, just because the two of you cannot get along.
Just to make the point, the player is not cheating. Our DM is really amazing. He gets us all to e-mail him our character sheets before a session. It was never about me thinking that his player was cheating. I was simply curious what class ability/utility power/feat/magic item he found that allowed him to shift 2 squares with a shift instead of one. That sort of thing would be very useful to my character (a ranger), and if it was something I could pick up in game I would. I didn't think it would be a big deal if he told me. Apparently it would be...
Thank you for the advice though Dark_cerebralmancer. I think it may be a little more confrontational then I would like to deal the situation, but I know exactly where you are coming from! For a few seconds there, I realy contemplated just saying, "ok, roll initiative, I'm attacking you."
Hrm. I thought at first that you might be coming across as pushy. But then, he's not willing to explain how he's bending rules? A bit of a red flag there.
My advice is to ask the other players, and see if you come across as overbearing to them as well. You might seem like you are trying to play the game for others, even if you don't mean to. Consider giving an explantion, knowing that you will take a while if a longer explantion is needed. Consider asking others to explain simply when the ruling is clear and a quicker explantion is better.
I would seriously ask the DM about the shifty business, but frame the question not as an accusation, but if you wanna learn the rules better to be clear on what your PC can and cannot do. Also ask about the combat thing, as his PC also merrily kicked the snot out of these peasants. See where the DM stands on this issue.
However, I do reccomend confronting this player as well! It's just not going to be possible to play if he's threatening your character for OoC things. Ask him how you can make the game enjoyable for the both of you. Unfortunately, you may have to move on if the group picks him over you. I cannot reccomend staying and losing friends, just because the two of you cannot get along.
All really good pieces of advice. I really might come across as pushy. My life partner often tells me that I come across a little rude (when I have no intention of being rude)! Its quite possible that he is reacting to something I am unintentionally doing (and am unaware of the fact that I am doing it).
On the friendship bit though, everyone in the group has only just met each other recently. If I end up feeling that I need to move on, truth is, one way or another its going to be the last I see of any of these people. Not because I will hold a grudge, or have bad blood against any of them, but just because none of them are my friends. I don't go drinking with them on Saturdays, or invite them over for x-box nights. I don't keep them updated on my childs growth. Really, my relation to them is pretty much strictly gaming. It might have been neat if our relationship would become more friendly over time, but we are still very much a brand new group. All of us have just met each other recently for the first time.
That is actually part of my problem with this issue. I don't know if I am overanalyzing, or overreacting, misreading body-language, or perhaps having my own body language misread. All I know is that right now I feel there is a problem, I don't want to make it worse, but if I can't feel I have put the problem to rest I am not really going to be enjoying our gaming nights anymore. I mean, honestly, who wants their characters life threatened because they are trying to role-play?
While I do not enjoy person to person conflict, I have no problem making it clear when somebody id pissing me off. I would have addressed the issue at the game table when it occurred. You really need to speak with him and the DM away from the game table. If talking with him and the DM causes extra problems then you should definitely walk away.
Should I just forward a link to this thread to my DM and ask him to read it? Does it seem like I am being unreasonable in this thread (IE: does it seem like I am still hotheaded over what happened and am ranting in this thread)?
I dunno. Why don't you log off the forums, attend to the spawnling, then come back? If you think you are being hot headed on the forums, nothing beats coming back after a day. Consider this ESPECIALLY if you intend for your DM to read this.
I would do it face to face, gives both of you a chance to lay the problems with each other on the table and see it they can be worled out.
I_roll_ones, I guess thats a good idea. I'll probably go do that now (minus the attending to the spawnling, because she is sleeping. I am sort of having a bought of insomnia right now). I guess I just sort of want a second opinion on how my posting in this thread is coming accross before I even consider asking my DM to read this thread.
Really, I don't know what I should do right now, and I don't know who is really at fault. All I know is that randomly having my characters life threatened by another player, out of the blue, for no good reason (at least none that I can see. It really seems to me that the player was actually just threateneding me because he felt that I was taking too long on something that he didn't really enjoy, to be honest) really ruined my fun today.
I would do it face to face, gives both of you a chance to lay the problems with each other on the table and see it they can be worled out.
Well, I think at first I would like to talk to my DM as see how my DM wants to deal with the problem. I don't really want to force a face to face talk with the player if the rest of the group would just feel that it would make the problem worse. I think my DM would be a good judge of what would be best for the group in that regard.
Also, I think I am more eloquent in written form than I am in verbal form.
Hopefully the other player will not feel that you went behind his back if you talk to the DM first.
Hopefully the other player will not feel that you went behind his back if you talk to the DM first.
Good point. Uggggh... 
I hate dealing with this sort of stuff. 
I agree that the situation sucks.
Since it bugs you enough to post about it, you should address it as quickly as possible. Soup is good when it simmers for a while, emotions don't simmer well.
I see the bottom line as this. If you address the issues with the DM present, there is a chance that the other guy will get belligerent, or worse act like his is going to change, and then get passive aggressive. There is also a chance that the two of you can find a way to work out the problems and get along.
Talk to the player involved before anyone else and be straight up about your thoughts that you have expressed here. be as diplomatic as possible, but do not moddle-coddle the issue as it is obviously bothering you and you obviously like the other aspects of the game.
Explain that no one is perfect, and that you have things that probably piss him off also, but state that you feel he is overly-aggressive towards your character or you.
We had an issue like this in my group, and once it was raised, I removed the player that the others believed were causing them distress (which were quite a few once the issue was brought forward)
And do not resort to PC vs PC... it will not help this case and probably make you both look like jerks.
Sometimes two people get along, alot of times they don't.
I like our gaming group, but I don't associate with them in any way, shape, or form outside the game ... they don't interest me. If our only universal like is D&D, then being friends simply because of that fact means that no way it could ever be a true friendship, at the very least it won't be very meaningful. People are like that ....
Some people come off needy though ... not saying you are ... but one person in an old group who didn't seem to get that I wasn't looking for a new friend...
For example .. after a 7 hour session....
"Hey man ... what you up to now?"
"Getting Subway ..."
"No way, I was planning to get something to eat too ... mind if I tag along?"
"Free country... "
-----------------------
After two weeks of gaming (once per week) he just assumed it was okay to follow me around for an hour or two after the game. Some people just want to game, they aren't looking for conversation, friendship or community ... they just like the game.
It sounds pretty obvious he doesn't want you to talk to him ... don't take it as an offense. Just some people just want to play the game. Not looking for friends.
Sure it's rude ... but it sounded from your own admission that you have your own quirks too. So you should be tolerant of other's, even if it seems 'rude' to you.
If the extent of the problem was him being a little rude when I ask him questions OOC at the game table (I have no desire, nor have I made any attempt, to hang out with him outside of the game) then I might be able to chalk it up to his ticks. I can live with me simply not liking his personality. The second he allowed those ticks to bleed into his IC actions, and started doing things like threatening my characters life a day after my character just saved his (in game day, a couple of minutes later real time), that changed. At that moment, the only IC reason my character has for not slitting this guys throat in the middle of his sleep is my characters good alignment. I certainly have no reason to ever save his characters life again. I definitely don't consider him to be an ally anymore. And, the next time his character does do something as stupid as threaten my character's life, I am going to respond by simple opening PC vs. PC combat. His actions haven't really given me another viable IC option, except for rolling over and role-playing his lapdog. That 'option' isn't really an option for me. I'm interested in playing a tough, if quirky, plains-halfling. However, PC vs. PC combat is never good for the dynamic of a gaming group. This takes his actions beyond the "ticks I can live with" category.
I'm sure it's possible that there are some things you are doing that you are unaware of.
However, I'm having a bit of trouble seeing how that player's responses would be justified regardless, especially if none of the other players are doing similarly.
If you don't understand the group dynamic, and the player seems like talking to him would be unproductive, choose the DM if it appears a better choice. Ask the DM what he/she sees happening at the table, and what the problems appear to be on the other side of the screen. At the least, it can give you another point of view.
Clearly express your point of view. Don't be overly apologetic; you don't know these people yet, so really, be at least assertive enough to ask for what you want out of the group, just as they all are doing in their own way.
If the current situation is making you think of attacking the other character, or quitting the group, let the DM know. Ask what kind if game the DM is trying to run, and whether those things are a part of the idea. The DM will either be "on your side" or he will suggest that yes, maybe you should leave the group. Probably less emotionally than that other player. Of course, some DMs are relatively oblivious and may argue for the status quo, but that would be a sign to talk with the other player or just leave.
Don't make up excuses. If you are obscure about things then the other group members will not know what the issue was. "I don't think this group is right for me" is plenty benign enough to not offend people.
More often than not though, when there are a bunch of new players together for the first time and it becomes an issue of one player clashing with another, the group will side with the one who was at least willing to think about things from different angles (i.e. you). If you're all strangers they have no vested interest in the jerk over the guy who might talk a little too much sometimes.
If you are having serious problems with just a single player's personality, it likely is not just you. If it was the whole group, it might be you -- but with just one guy it seems less likely.
Well, I don't personally feel that I am having issues with any of the other players. I really like everyone else who I am playing with. There was one disagreement over a rules interpretation, but it lasted all of 2 seconds. And, to be honest, even though at the time I thought I was correct, in retrospect the other players reading of the rule was the right one. I am fully willing to admit this! So, if someone else is having an issue with me, its unbeknown to me.
But, by the same token, I really don't think anyone else is having an issue with this particular player. He seems to be getting along with everyone else from what I have seen.
It really seems to just be me and him... I think.
But, by the same token, I really don't think anyone else is having an issue with this particular player. He seems to be getting along with everyone else from what I have seen.
It really seems to just be me and him... I think.
The others could be bothered by him and either have a higher BS tolerance level than you do, or have played with him for so long that they either have gotten used to it or have decided to live with it.
It really seems to just be me and him... I think.
In my experience, that sort of situation is pretty much impossible. Everyone has a viewpoint about everyone else, even if they don't express it. People are pretty good at sitting on their hands until prompted directly.
Either they similarly don't like that other player, or they don't like you (or conceivably, they hate both of you). I don't think anybody would be "undecided" for more than 2 sessions.
They might not care "as much," but they do care. Use yourself as an example, and think about your feelings toward all the other players individually. You either enjoy gaming with them, or you don't.
DMs sometimes come to the forums with stories about how they were too passive and let the annoying player drive off the good ones, because the good ones just made excuses and left. At least do the courtesy of mentioning ahead of time that you are considering quitting because of that other player.
I can't really think of a way for the scenario you described to end with "And now we just play DND and it is a great time for everyone".
I think I would bow out now, and tell the players I would like to play with again "But hey, if you are every looking for another player/DM keep me in mind". Maybe including, "So long as ___ is not there"
Although I have a pretty low tolerance for people ruining games. The first time I think "Oh, I have to go to DND" over "Awsome, tonight is DND night" is the last session for me.
I'll be honest Krusk, that is the direction I am leaning in right now. The effort of having to actually deal with conflict resolution just doesn't seem to be worth it for a game of D&D. If D&D games in Toronto didn't seem so rare right now, I think I would have already bowed out of the game. As it is, I have 2 weeks until the next session. One of the players can't be at that session, which will make it just me, the player I consider to be a problem player, and one other person (not counting our DM). I already know I don't want to go to that game. I dread playing without at least a 2 person buffer zone of other players (so I can just try and ignore his existence). As for the game after that, I don't even know if I am going to go to that one either. Even with two other people, its not like this player will suddenly not be there. I'm thinking he has made the game unpleasant enough for me that I am no longer interested in playing with them. I keep trying to think of a better way of solving the problem, one which still ends up with me playing D&D in the near future, but I really don't see it.
Cyber-Dave,
Check your Inbox, I just sent you some possibilities for other games.
For what it's worth, Cyber-Dave, as far as your concerns about your conduct in this thread should your DM read it go, I believe that your statement of the conflict with your fellow player was the most calm, rational, and fair-minded I have ever seen on these boards. Even in subsequent posts you say things like 'the player I find problematic' (I think, damn new forum not letting me read back while posting) instead of 'the problem player'. Your conduct is so downright sterling that I commented to myself about it when I first read the thread, before you raised the question of it. Put more nerdfully, if you were a character in my old 3e game, I'd probably let you take Vow of Poverty. 
For what it's worth, Cyber-Dave, as far as your concerns about your conduct in this thread should your DM read it go, I believe that your statement of the conflict with your fellow player was the most calm, rational, and fair-minded I have ever seen on these boards. Even in subsequent posts you say things like 'the player I find problematic' (I think, damn new forum not letting me read back while posting) instead of 'the problem player'. Your conduct is so downright sterling that I commented to myself about it when I first read the thread, before you raised the question of it. Put more nerdfully, if you were a character in my old 3e game, I'd probably let you take Vow of Poverty.
Thank you Mr. C. 
