This is my first campaign, everyone seems happy for me to be on board, I'm a dwarven slayer because it seemed like a fun and interesting class and relatively easy to manage. They're level 14 and they let me join in because they lost some players. So far I've been doing pretty good, and actually saved our groups butts from some encounters, even saving the paladin himself! But let's not go there because that's not what this thread is about. Every time I attempt to role-play my character, he gets mad at me because my character ends up doing something... well, less than good for his character.
The first example is that we were in a small building and I had dark vision. I could see creatures in the room, and for some reason he couldn't cast his light spell so I threw my axe at the cieling and it crumbled down, letting everyone see what was in the room. The DM then told us after the encounter that I crushed a treasure chest and that from what he could uhm.... piece together that it was something his character would have really liked. Now I can understand being upset but he started yelling at me even though I thought I really helped the situation, at least they didn't go into a fight blind with these guys which one of them stabbed my dwarf slayer in the back for 150 damage. I don't want to even think what would have happened to the casters if that happened to them. (Before you ask, I had a really good roll for my HP/constitution)
Anyway there were some other little things my character did that has upset him, but let's get to the second major upsettance. We were in a temple of bahamut, this temple has been sealed off for hundreds(I think) years after it was overrun by orc and other nasties by bahamut himself seeing it was easier to keep them inside the lost temple. Some of the temple was still draconic and sealed off from the orcs due to some rather clever puzzles, but basically they built a city under it more or less. Now, Dwarven slayers can't run from fights, because they want to die gloriously, but that doesn't mean he doesn't know a tactical retreat. I say this because we end up getting chased by a god-damn swarm of orcs back to the other side of the temple that was sealed off prior. I wanted to role-play my character who I assumed was probably pumping with adrenaline so I kicked a door open. There were a bunch of draconic figures, and long story short don't scare the **** out out of casters casting a very powerful ritual to hide an evil artifact so no one would use it, because it will turn the casters into ash.
So yeah, I killed about 20 or so dragons, and I really did know I ****ed up, but he started yelling at me and insulting me in real life until I actually had to threaten him to shut up because it was just a game. I don't like doing that, because i just want everyone to have fun, and I haven't had this problem with anyone else, and nobody has had this problem with me, even when the druid in our party accidentally destroyed something that was pretty important to how my character worked. (It let me rage without being a berserker/barbarian)
I just don't know what to do, he seems to forget quick, but it makes me feel real uneasy when he does do it, and if I'm at fault please do tell me and I'll try to change the way I play, but other than this, I feel my character has been doing a good job and everyone else says they're happy I joined the game because I really have helped out.
If you've gone through the process of reading this thank you, if not, I understand.
This is basically me venting, but what should I do? Any advice? Have any of you played with someone like this? Or am I the odd one out, knowing htat it's just a game and I shouldn't take it too seriously?
If that doesn't work, or you want a different option, talk to your DM. See if they know what the problem is and how to fix it.
Things like this tend to be misunderstadings that get blown out of proportion. Or this other player may think this is an enjoyable play of playing, not knowing you are genuinely upset.
The simplest solution is usually the best.
First, what edition are you playing in? Tends to make a difference.
Next, let me tell you that you are not, in fact, alone in thinking D&D is a game, and that taking things personally is the long side of out of line. The player of the Paladin is being obnoxious.
After that, let me advise you to sit down with your DM and find out why he's destroying items the party can use/needs. I can understand if it were something inherently breakable, like say a potion bottle or jar, but non-consumable items should be tough stuff, and although the ceiling caving in would (and should!) cost me a little extra work to get to, it shouldn't be broken and thus useless. That's just a cheap way to keep magic out of the Player's hands. Besides, why didn't the chest protect it? Anything sturdy enough to be worth using to secure valuables should also be useful in protecting it from harm... Just saying.
Chances are, this Player has been denied too often using the same or similar methods. (Note, casting Fireball in a Library would cost you the spell/ritual books within, if any, but the magic Dagger+1 in the Bag of Holding would likely survive). Talk to the DM and ask him seriously whyfor he's doing that. Admittedly, I make most of the *normal(read Not Magical)* gear (especially armor) useless after a fight. It'll have gouges, be shredded, weapons will be of poor quality, etc. Nothing wrong with that.
If they *really* insist on hauling all the crap out, they can, but they're not going to get very much for it(usually melt value for metal armor, and less for not metal. Robes are valueless). Magic items are generally intact, and of obvious quality. I realize that I'm telegraphing my intent here, but the Temple of Elemental Ebil alone had thousands upon thousands of GP in just weapons and armor. Far too much for Hommlett to take in. If they see something shiny, the ADHD nature of the players I usually attract tends to take over.
We geeks are extremely predictable like that.
Either way, bringing down the house, so to speak, was a clever thing to do, and I would have rewarded you for it... Instead, the DM spanked your Paladin. I can imagine why the charcter would have been offended. Taking it out on you, the Player was crossing the line.
Besides, the Paladin stuck you in the back(!) What kind of gentleman does that? Hope he's a Paladin of the Raven Queen or somesuch. Up until 4e, paladins had to be Lawful Good, and backstabbing is a nono.
-Sarena
I would suggest talking it over with this other player out-of-game. If they understand that this is upsetting you, it may be fixed then and there.
If that doesn't work, or you want a different option, talk to your DM. See if they know what the problem is and how to fix it.
Things like this tend to be misunderstadings that get blown out of proportion. Or this other player may think this is an enjoyable play of playing, not knowing you are genuinely upset.
The simplest solution is usually the best.
Sometimes, I agree. Welcome to the Forums, Ihateshowcase.
-Sarena
Hmm...let's see. I would suggest speaking politely with him on the topic. Attempt to get him to look at things from your point of view and see how he would respond were he to be on the recieving end of one of his own outbursts. Failing that, I suggest you start spiking his beverages with horse tranquilizer. Fair enough?
Take care, friend.
-Sarena
People like that tend to shut up once they figure out that the majority at the table can't stand them.
Well, Grace, for starters, welcome to the Forums. That first post can be kindof hairy, but you seem to have done okay.
First, what edition are you playing in? Tends to make a difference.
Next, let me tell you that you are not, in fact, alone in thinking D&D is a game, and that taking things personally is the long side of out of line. The player of the Paladin is being obnoxious.
After that, let me advise you to sit down with your DM and find out why he's destroying items the party can use/needs. I can understand if it were something inherently breakable, like say a potion bottle or jar, but non-consumable items should be tough stuff, and although the ceiling caving in would (and should!) cost me a little extra work to get to, it shouldn't be broken and thus useless. That's just a cheap way to keep magic out of the Player's hands. Besides, why didn't the chest protect it? Anything sturdy enough to be worth using to secure valuables should also be useful in protecting it from harm... Just saying.
Chances are, this Player has been denied too often using the same or similar methods. (Note, casting Fireball in a Library would cost you the spell/ritual books within, if any, but the magic Dagger+1 in the Bag of Holding would likely survive). Talk to the DM and ask him seriously whyfor he's doing that. Admittedly, I make most of the *normal(read Not Magical)* gear (especially armor) useless after a fight. It'll have gouges, be shredded, weapons will be of poor quality, etc. Nothing wrong with that.
If they *really* insist on hauling all the crap out, they can, but they're not going to get very much for it(usually melt value for metal armor, and less for not metal. Robes are valueless). Magic items are generally intact, and of obvious quality. I realize that I'm telegraphing my intent here, but the Temple of Elemental Ebil alone had thousands upon thousands of GP in just weapons and armor. Far too much for Hommlett to take in. If they see something shiny, the ADHD nature of the players I usually attract tends to take over.
We geeks are extremely predictable like that.
Either way, bringing down the house, so to speak, was a clever thing to do, and I would have rewarded you for it... Instead, the DM spanked your Paladin. I can imagine why the charcter would have been offended. Taking it out on you, the Player was crossing the line.
Besides, the Paladin stuck you in the back(!) What kind of gentleman does that? Hope he's a Paladin of the Raven Queen or somesuch. Up until 4e, paladins had to be Lawful Good, and backstabbing is a nono.
-Sarena
The edition is 3.5! And I'm loving the game so far besides this. I don't think the DM is punishing or rewarding anyone specifically, of course this whole side-venture is for the paladin, but he seems like the kind of guy who generally plans out everything in advance, I mean he has been doing it since the game was created so I respect his DMing abilities. And I don't want to ask questions like that and accidentally offend him in anyway. I mean there has been a time where I swear he manipulated the dice in my favor the first session I played. In fact, everyone was pretty amazed at what happened. ANYWAY!
That or he COULD be screwing with the paladin, but I'd have to talk to him separately to see what that's about. It could very well be that the DM is being an instigator. I honestly don't mind a few screw-ups here or there because I think it makes the game personally more interesting than having everything going according to plan. Or maybe the DM just assumes I'm going to screw things up and acts accordingly. Because even after I killed the people casting the ritual I used stone-cunning and found a button, which opened a slab which contained a scroll which gave us the location of Gruumsh's spear.
Yeah, I'll talk to the paladin as well, and tell him to cool his jets, it's not like I'm actively trying to destroy his stuff, it just keeps.... happening. There have been times where I have been tempted to break down walls though, and I do think "What if there's something behind this he might like?" And I don't. I really want to. But I don't, just in case because I keep having bad experiences with me breaking things. And no, the paladin hasn't done anything against my character yet, but I assume if things keep going badly he might, I mean I do understand in the context of the game I am breaking all of his stuff/people. But out of game when he gets mad it just gives me stress, everything in the game world I can handle becauase it's all in good fun. The thing that stabbed me in the back was a greenspawn lurk? I think it was called, anyway, I proceeded to turn around and roll a natural 20, cutting the thing in half diagonally, because it quite literally in the DM's words "Expected me to die".
Even though this is my first campaign ever my character already has some stories that seem, well, pretty awesome. If you care to hear about those, I'll indulge.
Would you believe the first time I played the game I ended up hundreds of feet in the air on a dragon? But; I'll leave it at that for now.
Edit: as for the ceiling caving in, the place was made out of stone, and luckily I rolled a 20. So I figure it was probably a wooden chest and a bunch of stone falling from a high ceiling might be enough to break a chest. I think the DM could have let it slide, but uhm. Well the paladin did have place to be upset in the game world... I mean, I did destroy a crystal with uhm..... bahamuts tears in it.
....I swear if I knew that would happen I would have never done it, but what's done is done, and I don't regret it. I also used some bahamut oils to make my character smell better because his stench was actually giving him -charisma, which he already had like none of. (I had a run in with a bad purple worm poison that promptly damaged my insides and later on made my dwarf.... crap himself because his intestines were damaged most in the process) The DM continued on that and went about how my dwarf found out that the oils were great beer chasers and my dwarf couldn't get enough. Which was hilarious to me, but something may be pointing to that he's just pushing the paladin's buttons. But then again, the paladin did get his own little baby dragon last play-through, so I think he's made up for it in my book. I'm not sure about the paladin's book though.
If taken to extremes, or done clumsily, it can lead to party strife.
If done with skill, it can lead to a great story based on the character interaction within the group.
From your description, it appears to be treading a middle ground, perhaps a closer to the latter more enjoyable outcome. The Paladin's player may be used to this style and over-acting "in character", or he may be genuinely taking it too seriously, it is difficult to tell from your posts so far.
I would agree you can talk to him about it. Make it clear which bits are upsetting. Perhaps you can even agree a codeword like the Dwarf grumbling "Hobbits!" to communicate to the Paladin's player that you are feeling uncomfortable out-of-character, and the game should move on.
Horse Tranquilizer might be a tad extreme. Maybe finding the DM a girlfriend might work better.
-Sarena
...perhaps you're right.
Take care, friend.
Also, the DM telling you that there would have been a chest and such is something he shouldn't have done unless you searched the area and found out ingame. That's just a slap in the face for the paladin, nothing more, nothing less. Still, the player should dial it down and not get angry at you. It's not like there was a sign on the wall saying "great loot for the paladin inside" or somesuch. Tell him to calm down.
Keep in mind that I'm not overly familiar with 3.5, but - a crystal with the tears of a major god? Shouldn't that be pretty much indestructible?
In 3.5, you had to be trying to break a magic item, and even then success was never a guarantee. No way would you be able to destroy an Artifact. You had to go to some incredibly extreme lengths to do that. (Think Bilbo, Frodo, and The One Ring). Somebody's getting his chain jerked.
The Crystal Tears or Bahamut (if authentic) would I think count as an Artifact.
-Sarena
No, not really.
But seriously, you guys came through it fine, and if you trust your DM I'm sure that replacement items will appear in due time. None of your actions seemed unreasonable at all – in fact, sounds like a seriously action-packed and dramatic game, which is exactly as it should be.
Obviously it's hard to know what is really going on with only one side of the story, but based on your description these player needs to be told to cool it.
I played in a game with a player who fancied himself our leader. He claimed this was just RP, since he had claimed at the beginning that his bard was the leader of the party and nobody disputed it, but really he was just an authoritarian little… word I can't say here… who would start ranting anytime a player had their character do something without his express permission (even when there couldn't possibly have been an opportunity for the two characters to communicate… even when the two characters were in separate rooms…) Ultimately there was nothing to do but ignore him. Luckily we didn't have to give him the boot because when he realized that we didn't respect his fearless leadership he just stopped showing up.
Anyway, not sure how that story helps you. Just saying I feel your pain.
Keep in mind that I'm not overly familiar with 3.5, but - a crystal with the tears of a major god? Shouldn't that be pretty much indestructible?
In 3.5, you had to be trying to break a magic item, and even then success was never a guarantee. No way would you be able to destroy an Artifact. You had to go to some incredibly extreme lengths to do that. (Think Bilbo, Frodo, and The One Ring). Somebody's getting his chain jerked.
The Crystal Tears or Bahamut (if authentic) would I think count as an Artifact.
-Sarena
Well, the DM just told us we could see broken bits of glass and wood and liquid under all the rubble once we cleared it, and someone used a knowledge check to identify it once was a treasure chest. And the paladin kept pushing it after the game, asking what was in the chest, so I think he might have annoyed the DM and he might have told him that to just told him that because he was annoying him, but as a result it made him mad at me.
Yeah, hopefully we'll get to play tomorrow or this weekend but I'll try to talk to each one of them separately beforehand.
And I didn't think so many would say that me collapsing a roof was a 'bright' idea.
Get it? Bright? Because I did it so we could see. It's a pun.
Get it? Bright? Because I did it so we could see. It's a pun.
That's funny :D
Your theory is probably correct, but again, that player has as much right to go after you as he did to badger the DM. He needs a break before somebody breaks him. Not sure about the little details, but how many girls do you have in that group?
He could be trying to pull a dominance game.
-Sarena
Three guys, four if you include the DM. If that's really what it is I'd laugh my butt off.
Thanks for all the help by the way, spartan.
Two girls, warlock and druid.
Three guys, four if you include the DM. If that's really what it is I'd laugh my butt off.
Thanks for all the help by the way, spartan.
I'm usually either DS or Sarena, and you're very welcome.
Dominance games do happen from time to time, and the guy I mentioned earlier, The Cheater, is one who loves those sorts of games. He can't stand the idea of living even in the same city as a woman that's not sleeping with him, and jumping when he croaks "frog." Can't stand that. I was DM for that group, and every moment in the same room with him was a struggle.
I'm well and truly glad to have that monkey mostly off my back.
-Sarena
So, like I said, get an idea of *why* the DM is doing this. Don't get annoyed, or bring it as a grievance or anything, just as something you noticed him doing, and wanted to know where he was going with it. He is a guy who plans things out in advance after all. It's not unreasonable to think he has a plan here. Once you have that, you'll be in a better position to talk with the Paladin's player.
The first example is that we were in a small building and I had dark vision. I could see creatures in the room, and for some reason he couldn't cast his light spell so I threw my axe at the cieling and it crumbled down, letting everyone see what was in the room. The DM then told us after the encounter that I crushed a treasure chest and that from what he could uhm.... piece together that it was something his character would have really liked.
Well the crushed treasure chest seems somewhat iffy on the DM's part, it seems a petty thing to do to but I suspect that there was no treasure chest with that item in it and the DM was just saying that to get a rise out of him.
I didn't see anything here that you have done that is terribly out of line. Your overbearing friend just seems to attached/greedy to goodies in game. In my opinion the DM should be working to take the focus of his rage off you and turn it against a monster that stole his brand new pally weapon you just purchased for him. And if the monster happens to be Tiamat, go ahead, let that pally call him stuipd lets see what happens.
The player defiantly needs to grow up a bit imo. I don't suggest this for you, but if I was in your shoes I'd fight fire with fire. Assuming his character doesn't like your character much, there is no reason to think your character should like him. Next time we were at a tavern together i'd skip out find me a thiefy type person to chat with and pay the theif to steal stuff from him (or worse). This opens a lot of hooks for your DM and may cause your character extra strife but I would defiantly find it entertaining.