Is there any Divine Classes that fight at range?

Post/Author/DateTimePost
#1

ryukfayt

Jun 28, 2009 15:21:15
I want to play a guy who shoots magical arrows at people, I got the inspiration from Uryu from Bleach. Here's a picture.


#2

salla

Jun 28, 2009 15:23:11
Laser cleric and invoker both do stuff at range. Refluffing the special effects of the powers into a bow shouldn't be too difficult.

You could probably go Warlock or Sorcerer as well.
#3

corncob

Jun 28, 2009 15:39:25
Heck, Avengers have ranged powers too.
#4

salla

Jun 28, 2009 15:44:35
Heck, Avengers have ranged powers too.

True, but not many and they don't work with the Avenger's primary class feature, the Oath of Enmity.
#5

ChrisTheS

Jun 28, 2009 15:54:55
If you take many of the melee cleric powers and rewrite them as ranged (replacing Str with Dex in all cases and changing any riders that say 'within X squares of you' to 'within X squares of the target') they work quite well - I did this to assuage the sensibilities of a player who wouldn't have played if he'd had to multiclass to get a cleric with a bow, and so far it's not proved problematic.
#6

calronmoonflower

Jun 28, 2009 16:54:13
For a picture that large it is considered good manners to sblock it so it doesn't expand the size of the thread.

In other words please put these tags around it: [noparse]
#7

ryukfayt

Jun 28, 2009 17:12:40
Done, thanks!
#8

bjornfellhanded

Jun 28, 2009 17:29:16
You can always reflavor the Bard and use their Paragon Path that lets them use a bow for their implent and range.
#9

dark_lambo

Jun 28, 2009 18:11:53
That pictures doesn't look like someone shooting magic arrows. Which would imply an actual bow and arrows.

It just looks like magic that looks like that. Describing a (for example) laser cleric as doing that would probably replicate it exactly.

I mean, the dude in the picture doesn't even have a bow.
#10

calronmoonflower

Jun 28, 2009 20:00:30
Actually Uryu form a bow and arrows out of spiritual energy.
The closest that I know of in 4th so far is an expansion of the bard class from Arcane Power and some alchemical items that can be made into ammunition.

If you don't mind houserules you might try this: [thread=1066474]Soul Blade (4th soulknife as Feats)[/thread]
#11

inkblot

Jun 29, 2009 0:39:16
I played a character like that a few months ago. It worked great.

Cleric with Ranger multiclass feat. Focused on Wisdom and Dexterity. No need for Strength. He didn't even carry a melee weapon.

All his powers were ranged radiant powers. I described them as attacks with a bow and arrows of silvery light, which he summoned into his hands with a prayer.

Below is a portrait of my character.

#12

auspex7

Jun 29, 2009 6:02:17
Cleric/Ranger with high dex and wis works great! Even if you don't reflavor the attacks to use at-wills heavily, you can have a ball just using ranged basics with a bow or crossbow, and using the at-wills for their tertiary effects as desired. Of course, a liberal sprinkling of MC power swaps sets you up very well for some cool options, and you may even consider going the PMC route for a nice selection of things to do during fights at paragon+.
#13

stogoe

Jun 29, 2009 7:10:37
I did this to assuage the sensibilities of a player who wouldn't have played if he'd had to multiclass to get a cleric with a bow, and so far it's not proved problematic.

Isn't the Cleric Archer an artifact of the 3e ruleset? Was it actually an archetype before it became the de facto PHB-only pwnfest?
#14

AvonRekaes

Jun 29, 2009 10:54:05
I don't recall ever hearing anything about uber bow-priests in 3e, but in Eberron the Silver Flame's favored weapon was the longbow (and its holy symbol an arrowhead).

(I made a magic item for worhsipers of the Silver Flame that functions like a holy avenger. It's a longbow that can be used as a holy symbol for any worshiper of the Flame, and creates its own ammunition which deals radiant damage. Works best with Clerics and Invokers.)
#15

The_White_Sorcerer

Jun 29, 2009 15:43:51
Actually Uryu form a bow and arrows out of spiritual energy.
The closest that I know of in 4th so far is an expansion of the bard class from Arcane Power and some alchemical items that can be made into ammunition.

So if he forms the bow out of spiritual energy, how is a class that uses a physical bow and arrows a closer fit than one that just shoots energy, which can be refluffed as a spiritual bow? The only time I've seen Ishida use a bow that was an actual item was in that weird fanfic with the vampires, and that doesn't count.
#16

Nibelung_ajr

Jun 29, 2009 18:28:07
I played a character like that a few months ago. It worked great.

Cleric with Ranger multiclass feat. Focused on Wisdom and Dexterity. No need for Strength. He didn't even carry a melee weapon.

All his powers were ranged radiant powers. I described them as attacks with a bow and arrows of silvery light, which he summoned into his hands with a prayer.

On my sig there is an archer paladin, almost the same thinking. I plan to rebuild him after DP appear on Builder. Paladin (after paragon) is great for increase DPR using Divine Challenge as an "almost-ongoing-17-damage".
#17

tipop

Jun 29, 2009 18:38:11
Actually Uryu form a bow and arrows out of spiritual energy.

...which you would not get by playing a character that uses a real bow.
The closest that I know of in 4th so far is an expansion of the bard class from Arcane Power and some alchemical items that can be made into ammunition.

The closest in 4th edition would be any caster using radiant-damage spells, with the *description* that he's creating a bow out of spiritual energy.
#18

ryukfayt

Jun 29, 2009 18:45:22
Are Invokers good? I played a Wizard once but I couldn't do anything without hurting my allies unless I used ray of Frost. >_>
#19

ryukfayt

Jun 29, 2009 19:04:22
A Bard sounds interesting aswell...
#20

the_fan

Jun 29, 2009 21:19:32
Invokers are pretty cool. Their area attacks will often target just enemies instead of all creatures, so that's a major plus.

The Bard option with Virtue of Prescience might work well, but for that you need PHB2 and Arcane Power. Lots of attacks with arrows that debuff enemies or set up your allies for better hits. Also, though not divine, it IS based on Wisdom like most divine classes.
#21

Rustmonster

Jun 29, 2009 23:13:54
Isn't the Cleric Archer an artifact of the 3e ruleset? Was it actually an archetype before it became the de facto PHB-only pwnfest?

In the olden days, before AD&D at least (can't speak for AD&D cause I never played them), Clerics were barred completely from using anything sharp as a weapon. So in the older games, no, they couldn't.
#22

calronmoonflower

Jun 30, 2009 1:50:12
So if he forms the bow out of spiritual energy, how is a class that uses a physical bow and arrows a closer fit than one that just shoots energy, which can be refluffed as a spiritual bow? The only time I've seen Ishida use a bow that was an actual item was in that weird fanfic with the vampires, and that doesn't count.

Sorry for not being clear, I provided a link that would allow the formation of a bow out of spirit energy.
Reflavoring ranged implement power would also be an option.

However the question asked was about shooting magic arrows, not replicating Uryu.
The bard expansion does that, but lacks the divine aspect.

...which you would not get by playing a character that uses a real bow.

Again the link I provided would get around that.
Also the original poster didn't ask to replicate Uryu

The closest in 4th edition would be any caster using radiant-damage spells, with the *description* that he's creating a bow out of spiritual energy.

Or use the houserules that I provided.
#23

esperifiel

Jul 03, 2009 5:38:12
"Bow" and "arrows" are fluff. Ranged radiant damage is crunch.

You're looking for an invoker, period.

Avenging Light, Divine Bolts, Grasping Shards, Sun Strike - all pew pew god lazerz.

Make them all look like arrows of light. Done deal.

The magic bow? There is none, unless he uses a rod implement to make bettar pew pew - and make the rod look like the grip of a bow...
#24

kouk

Jul 03, 2009 8:38:43
Clerics that focus on ranged attacks, or "lazer clerics" have poor range on their at-will attacks, just 5.

Invoker at-wills are all 10.

If you play a controller, your party is expected to work with you a little to not block all your attacks though. Your own ability to move around and target different squares as the origin of bursts is usually enough to hit just enemies.

If there's just one enemy and the other players want to flank it, you should have some kind of single target or enemy-only ability, but when there's multiple enemies still on the field you can go after the others with disabling effects. (Protip: If your allies flank diagonally, you can hit the target with an area burst attack while not hitting your allies.)
#25

calronmoonflower

Jul 03, 2009 13:57:39
I've also heard of a issue an D&Di issue of Dragon that features magic arrows.
I think it was 373, but I'm not sure.
#26

entropy_judge

Jul 03, 2009 16:20:34
In the olden days, before AD&D at least (can't speak for AD&D cause I never played them), Clerics were barred completely from using anything sharp as a weapon. So in the older games, no, they couldn't.

AD&D Clerics weren't allowed Edged weapons either - except that in the Deities & Demigods it allowed characters to use their deity's weapon even if it was edged.
#27

salla

Jul 03, 2009 16:59:31
In the olden days, before AD&D at least (can't speak for AD&D cause I never played them), Clerics were barred completely from using anything sharp as a weapon. So in the older games, no, they couldn't.

Which was stupid, really. According to the text, it was because they were forbidden to wield weapons that could shed blood. I'm sorry, but if you hit someone in the skull really hard with a mace, there will be blood.
#28

calronmoonflower

Jul 03, 2009 18:58:35
Which was stupid, really. According to the text, it was because they were forbidden to wield weapons that could shed blood. I'm sorry, but if you hit someone in the skull really hard with a mace, there will be blood.

I've had paper cuts bleed. Does that mean they cannot wield their holy manuscripts? :P
#29

salla

Jul 03, 2009 19:02:08
I've had paper cuts bleed. Does that mean they cannot wield their holy manuscripts? :P

No, but they aren't allowed to swing them at other people.
#30

mrdoobie

Jul 03, 2009 19:49:39
Which was stupid, really. According to the text, it was because they were forbidden to wield weapons that could shed blood. I'm sorry, but if you hit someone in the skull really hard with a mace, there will be blood.

However, in the Medevil period, priests that went into war sometimes went by that rule. So it's not some stupid rule made up sheerly for D&D, it has a basis in real life
#31

salla

Jul 03, 2009 19:58:31
However, in the Medevil period, priests that went into war sometimes went by that rule. So it's not some stupid rule made up sheerly for D&D, it has a basis in real life

Perhaps, but that doesn't make it less stupid.
#32

mrdoobie

Jul 03, 2009 20:20:57
Perhaps, but that doesn't make it less stupid.

A lot of things Europeans did in the Middle Ages was stupid.
#33

salla

Jul 03, 2009 20:24:42
A lot of things Europeans did in the Middle Ages was stupid.

No arguments. Fortunately, since D&D doesn't take place in Earth's Middle Ages, we can ignore them when we play the game.
#34

Ogiwan

Jul 04, 2009 8:59:00
True story. IIRC, I think maile was, coincidentally, the Big Thing at that time, and maile does squat against a mace. Sucks to be them.
#35

slyjay

Jul 17, 2009 16:46:45
Are Invokers good? I played a Wizard once but I couldn't do anything without hurting my allies unless I used ray of Frost. >_>

But... but... blowing up your party is part of the fun!