Over the last few weeks (we're all level 14) the rogue has been using a crossbow and doing (Weapon/Power Damage) + (19) + (sneak attack damage (+str)) for all attacks. Basic ranged, powers, etc.
I've sat and tried to figure it out, but I can not see how he's legally doing that much damage. Our Sorceress, also ranged, gets a +16 on some of her attacks to damage, and then with her Elemental Staff it goes up to +18, but she's still not doing sneak attack damage above that.
Also, this must either be the DM forgetting or he's put it into his build, but he's burning action points to do more attacks and doing sneak attack damage on every one.
So my question essentially is, how is he getting that +19? How do I know it's plus 19? He keeps saying it out loud when adding the damage lol.
My thoughts:
+6 for dex mod
+3 Weapon
+2 Weapon Focus
+4 (I know there's melee gloves that do +4 dmg to melee attacks, dunno about ranged but I'd assume they exist)
That's +15. He might be adding a str mod of...What? 4 to get 19? But then he's adding it multiple times, even when it's a power that normally wouldn't.
I dunno, what do you guys think? I'm still fairly new to the details of the game so I might just be missing something. Or maybe the Sorceress is pretty weak. :P
My question is how is he maintaining Combat Advantage on the enemy, you HAVE to have it to get sneak attack damage.
LOL. He chews us out all the time if we don't arrange combat advantage for him. He has distant advantage -- IE: If allies are flanking, you get combat advantage.
+6 dexterity
+4 Bracers of Archery
+2 Weapon focus
+6 strength (sneak attack from rogue class feature)
+3 magic weapon
That brings the total to +21 with sneak attack. So maybe he isn't quite that optimized.
He might have steady shooter, which would neccesitate a +5 strength mod in order to pull of the Con score you would need in order to buy it. That would give it a +2 bump (+3 for steady shooter/-1 for the loss of a Str mod). The total would then be +23, but again, he may not have some of the combo.
Your sorcerous, depending on race, could have:
+6 charisma
+6 strength or dex, depending on sorcerer class ability
+6 implements (+3 main hand, +3 offhand with dual implement spellcaster)
+2 weapon focus (dagger or staff, depending on your implement choice)
Total +20.
She can optimize this even more depending on race/feat selection. Wintercheeze would add +5 in many situations. If your DM allows staff of ruin offhand item bonus, then another +3. The 12th level shard from the Eberron Player's Guide could be attached to your main hand dagger for another +3.
It's not hard to get a +19 to damage at level 14.
Assume he started with an 18 in Strength and Dex, say, a half orc or bugbear? Assume Brutal Scoundrel.
Now he has 22s in both.
So:
+6 Dex, +6 Str, +4 Weapon, +4 Gauntlets of Archery (bow equivalent of iron armbands of power), +3 Weapon Focus, +3 for the standing will w/a crossbow feat... that's 26.
That's also assuming some serious gear, and combat advantage. My point is, +19 to damage isn't that big of a deal. Defenders usually have that sort of bonus to damage around level 16.
LOL. He chews us out all the time if we don't arrange combat advantage for him. He has distant advantage -- IE: If allies are flanking, you get combat advantage.
The DMPC needs to die so he can focus on DMing.
Also, his race is a human. And how do you get +3 weapon focus at level 14?
And assuming what you're saying is true that it's actually really low, what's wrong with our sorceress who ranges from +16-24 on her attacks? That's way less than a rogue doing +19+3D8+str mod on attacks every attack.
EDIT:
I see the earlier build for Sorceress. She's only getting a +5 to str because the DM screwed over her stats (thread in the Player's complaint forum lol). And she's not allowed to start with dual implements. So...Yeah. We might want to change that.
If you were two levels higher, I would say he could have taken multiclass fighter with the Kensai paragon path. That would net him a constant +4 to damage but that power doesn't kick in till 16th. On the other hand, maybe he made his character higher level.
On the other hand, maybe he made his character higher level.
Good thought. :D
At least then you'd know the recipe.
Or maybe you should simply ask him.
Otherwise? Quit worrying about it. Why? Because it's an NPC being run by the DM. It doesn't have to follow the same rules as your characters do.
You did not mention what race he was, which will affect things a little. But if he is a str/dex race (half-orc) it could break down this way.
+6 dexterity
+4 Bracers of Archery
+2 Weapon focus
+6 strength (sneak attack from rogue class feature)
+3 magic weapon
That brings the total to +21 with sneak attack. So maybe he isn't quite that optimized.
He might have steady shooter, which would neccesitate a +5 strength mod in order to pull of the Con score you would need in order to buy it. That would give it a +2 bump (+3 for steady shooter/-1 for the loss of a Str mod). The total would then be +23, but again, he may not have some of the combo.
Your sorcerous, depending on race, could have:
+6 charisma
+6 strength or dex, depending on sorcerer class ability
+6 implements (+3 main hand, +3 offhand with dual implement spellcaster)
+2 weapon focus (dagger or staff, depending on your implement choice)
Total +20.
She can optimize this even more depending on race/feat selection. Wintercheeze would add +5 in many situations. If your DM allows staff of ruin offhand item bonus, then another +3. The 12th level shard from the Eberron Player's Guide could be attached to your main hand dagger for another +3.
And another +3 with a subtle dagger in the off-hand and combat advantage.
And another +3 with a subtle dagger in the off-hand and combat advantage.
Subtle dagger wouldn't have any effect on him using a crossbow, the bonus from the dagger only counts when you use the dagger to attack.
The DMPC needs to die so he can focus on DMing.
I agree.
I have an NPC helping my characters in the campaign I run. He's a goblin ranger. For the storyline, he's there to guide them through the forest they're in. When it comes to combat, I put the focus on the PCs. I'll have the NPC help when it's pertinent, but for the most part, I keep him at range, firing off arrows here and there. He's only there for the story. I can't imagine what my players would do to me if I *****ed about getting my NPC combat advantage, lol.
Subtle dagger wouldn't have any effect on him using a crossbow, the bonus from the dagger only counts when you use the dagger to attack.
I think he was talking about for the Sorcerer.
Subtle dagger wouldn't have any effect on him using a crossbow, the bonus from the dagger only counts when you use the dagger to attack.
Actually, it's a passive property, you need only wield it in the off hand.
But I was talking about the sorcerer.
I like monterey jack myself, but you gotta love 4ed cheese. Guess my bard|rogue hasn't been doing as much as he should be.
It's only cheesy when you combine it with a build that can have combat advantage all the time.
Like my Swordmage|Warlock w/ Hybrid Talent (shadow walk) that's going to take the Umbriri paragon path for the level 16 Concealment = CA trick.
The DMPC needs to die so he can focus on DMing.
I have a few "DMPCs" with my group. Or rather, they're NPCs that story-wise follow them around.
They're built as NPCs, but they contribute to the XP budget. It works nicely since the party is down to a Monk and a Bard, as the Sorc and Pally players went poof. So they've usually got an NPC Defender with them, and perhaps an extra.
I've run one NPC, two NPCs, and zero NPCs.
I found that one NPC slowed me down (as I have to essentially attack myself, so the mental tactical switch slows me). Two NPCs was really sluggish. Handing the NPCs off to the players, comparatively, speed up combat. At least twice the speed of me having to run two allies, and maybe 50% faster than running one ally.
DMPCs are blegh to me. I don't want to bother! :P
What attack is he using every round? As an Artful Dodger rogue, I'd think he'd be using Sly Flourish. That gives 1[W] + DEX + CHA damage plus the other bonuses. I bet that's how he's getting his 19.
He's getting the +19 dmg no the matter the attack (all ranged, however). He does a lot of basic ranged attacks, and I couldn't find a power that rogues can use as a basic.
But aside from that, whenever he does use a power he's also getting the +19 (Such as a burst attack he did in our last session, he did +19 damage to all of them).
Also, he's somehow managing to get a +23 on his attack roll. I just realized this today when I remembered he said he only misses on a 1, but wouldn't normally if 1's weren't an automatic miss...And the mobs had 24 AC/Reflex, then higher wills and fortitudes.