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my new character role

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
lwr
May 28, 2009 4:47:27 Hi all,

Please help me. My last character died in the last session of ours. It was a dragonborn rogue (brawny rogue in fact). Our group consists one fighter, one paladin and one warlock. What should be my new character's role (leader, striker, etc...) and please proived me with some suggestions about his class.

I have an idea about what do I like. It's the adroit explorer paragon path. I want to build something around this. So, I know that the character's race must be human. I do not want to play with a rogue again. I would like to play with something new.
#2
Neutronium_Dragon
May 28, 2009 4:58:53 If your sole interest is in filling the gaps in the group, and you're willing to try/do anything, then the bard is probably the best choice.

You have two defenders, one of which leans leader and one striker, and a striker who leans controller. You're fairly well covered in terms of strikers and defenders, thus, but leader and controller are notably wanting.

Since he's a leader who leans controller, the bard is a great match to the other three. A bard also fits the theme of the adroit explorer, so you've got a theme match as well as a mechanics one.

Of course, none of this matters if you don't like playing the bard. While it's *useful* to cover all four roles, it's not *required* by the system. You might find that some other class suits you better, in which case you should probably choose that rather than something you feel forced to play.
#3
lwr
May 28, 2009 5:16:48 I also think that the the general flavor of the bard suits well for the adroit explorer. I have even started to make my character. Since the party is at level 9 it wouldn't be so much to adventure to start the paragon path.

My only concerns are: what bard builds should be ideal, cunning bard or valorus bard? Will I be able to make use of the extras that the human race gives (one extra at-will power) and the extras the adroit explorer gives (extra 7/13 or lower level enounter power, one extra action point at level 16)? In other words, are there so many good bard at-will and encounter powers?
#4
Neutronium_Dragon
May 28, 2009 5:40:03 Cunning vs Valorous is really going to depend on the particulars of your group and what usually gives your group greater trouble - withstanding damage (in which case Valorous will help you more) or tactical positioning (which means that Cunning is what you need).

Don't forget to take Action Surge as one of your feats! This synergizes very well with your paragon path. Another worthwhile one is Jack of All Trades, since this will stack with your class-based skill boost to untrained skills and make you almost as good at untrained skills as you are at trained ones.

Bards have enough powers for you to take advantage of the paragon path, and Arcane Power expands on this selection. Even if you find that there aren't any that interest you at a given level, leveraging the Multiclass Versatility trait means that you can pick and choose power swaps from among several other classes, so you can probably find something worthwhile.
#5
tiornys
May 28, 2009 5:45:02
I also think that the the general flavor of the bard suits well for the adroit explorer. I have even started to make my character. Since the party is at level 9 it wouldn't be so much to adventure to start the paragon path.

My only concerns are: what bard builds should be ideal, cunning bard or valorus bard? Will I be able to make use of the extras that the human race gives (one extra at-will power) and the extras the adroit explorer gives (extra 7/13 or lower level enounter power, one extra action point at level 16)? In other words, are there so many good bard at-will and encounter powers?

Both builds of the Bard are strong, IMO, and both will work well with Adroit Explorer. Cunning Bards are a bit better suited to ranged combat while Valorous Bards are a bit better at melee, but both builds can do either style. CharOp's Bard Handbook has a slight preference for Cunning.

One thing you should consider is how often your other party members have temporary hit points. If your Warlock is Infernal pact, your Paladin is Cha-based, and your Fighter is a Battlerager, the Valor Bard looks a lot weaker since all of your party members already grant themselves temporary hit-points (and temp HP's don't stack).

If overlapping temp HP's isn't an issue, go with the build whose flavor you prefer.

t~
#6
lwr
May 28, 2009 6:43:28 The fighter is a simple PHB1 fighter, not a battlerager. So, he doesn't get temp hit points often. The paladin is charisma based so, sometimes he gets temp hit points. The warlock is almost always have temp hit points.

Since both the fighter and paladin wear heavy armor, thier speed is reduced. So, tactical positioning would be useful (I have to tell you that my warlord, who died before my rogue, was not so useful with his positioning powers).

So, you suggest jack of all trades. How about the bardic knowledge feat? Which one would you prefer? Action surge is a must in my opinion. Human persevarence?
#7
aivaruin
May 28, 2009 8:40:52 Some Mod should move this thread to Leader section by now.

About bardic knowledge. Pick both. Just be sure that you are trained in those skills that are buffed by Knowlege. That way feat bonuses do not overley. And as a human you get one more skill training left open.

Judging by your party composition Cunning is the way for you.

Human perservance? It seems like decent filler feat. But I dont think you have space for it.
#8
lwr
May 28, 2009 9:04:43 Thank you guys for the help. If any of you have any other idea, it's welcome.
#9
lemonfrosted_dup
May 28, 2009 9:28:33 With two Defenders up in melée I think Cunning might be the way to go.

Also you need to consider weapon choice/power mix. You could stick with the given proficiencies, or grab a superior weapon like a rapier or fullblade. Wait, fullblade? Yes! Just grab Quick Draw for your Implement powers and a nice initiative bonus. Or eschew weapon powers and double-fist wands with Dual Implement Caster, with the off-hand wand holding an encounter utility spell like Jump or Shield.

And don't worry: there's more than enough good encounter powers to grab with Adroit Explorer.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 lwr May 28, 2009 4:47:27	Hi all, Please help me. My last character died in the last session of ours. It was a dragonborn rogue (brawny rogue in fact). Our group consists one fighter, one paladin and one warlock. What should be my new character's role (leader, striker, etc...) and please proived me with some suggestions about his class. I have an idea about what do I like. It's the adroit explorer paragon path. I want to build something around this. So, I know that the character's race must be human. I do not want to play with a rogue again. I would like to play with something new.
#2 Neutronium_Dragon May 28, 2009 4:58:53	If your sole interest is in filling the gaps in the group, and you're willing to try/do anything, then the bard is probably the best choice. You have two defenders, one of which leans leader and one striker, and a striker who leans controller. You're fairly well covered in terms of strikers and defenders, thus, but leader and controller are notably wanting. Since he's a leader who leans controller, the bard is a great match to the other three. A bard also fits the theme of the adroit explorer, so you've got a theme match as well as a mechanics one. Of course, none of this matters if you don't like playing the bard. While it's useful to cover all four roles, it's not required by the system. You might find that some other class suits you better, in which case you should probably choose that rather than something you feel forced to play.
#3 lwr May 28, 2009 5:16:48	I also think that the the general flavor of the bard suits well for the adroit explorer. I have even started to make my character. Since the party is at level 9 it wouldn't be so much to adventure to start the paragon path. My only concerns are: what bard builds should be ideal, cunning bard or valorus bard? Will I be able to make use of the extras that the human race gives (one extra at-will power) and the extras the adroit explorer gives (extra 7/13 or lower level enounter power, one extra action point at level 16)? In other words, are there so many good bard at-will and encounter powers?
#4 Neutronium_Dragon May 28, 2009 5:40:03	Cunning vs Valorous is really going to depend on the particulars of your group and what usually gives your group greater trouble - withstanding damage (in which case Valorous will help you more) or tactical positioning (which means that Cunning is what you need). Don't forget to take Action Surge as one of your feats! This synergizes very well with your paragon path. Another worthwhile one is Jack of All Trades, since this will stack with your class-based skill boost to untrained skills and make you almost as good at untrained skills as you are at trained ones. Bards have enough powers for you to take advantage of the paragon path, and Arcane Power expands on this selection. Even if you find that there aren't any that interest you at a given level, leveraging the Multiclass Versatility trait means that you can pick and choose power swaps from among several other classes, so you can probably find something worthwhile.
#5 tiornys May 28, 2009 5:45:02	I also think that the the general flavor of the bard suits well for the adroit explorer. I have even started to make my character. Since the party is at level 9 it wouldn't be so much to adventure to start the paragon path. My only concerns are: what bard builds should be ideal, cunning bard or valorus bard? Will I be able to make use of the extras that the human race gives (one extra at-will power) and the extras the adroit explorer gives (extra 7/13 or lower level enounter power, one extra action point at level 16)? In other words, are there so many good bard at-will and encounter powers? Both builds of the Bard are strong, IMO, and both will work well with Adroit Explorer. Cunning Bards are a bit better suited to ranged combat while Valorous Bards are a bit better at melee, but both builds can do either style. CharOp's Bard Handbook has a slight preference for Cunning. One thing you should consider is how often your other party members have temporary hit points. If your Warlock is Infernal pact, your Paladin is Cha-based, and your Fighter is a Battlerager, the Valor Bard looks a lot weaker since all of your party members already grant themselves temporary hit-points (and temp HP's don't stack). If overlapping temp HP's isn't an issue, go with the build whose flavor you prefer. t~
#6 lwr May 28, 2009 6:43:28	The fighter is a simple PHB1 fighter, not a battlerager. So, he doesn't get temp hit points often. The paladin is charisma based so, sometimes he gets temp hit points. The warlock is almost always have temp hit points. Since both the fighter and paladin wear heavy armor, thier speed is reduced. So, tactical positioning would be useful (I have to tell you that my warlord, who died before my rogue, was not so useful with his positioning powers). So, you suggest jack of all trades. How about the bardic knowledge feat? Which one would you prefer? Action surge is a must in my opinion. Human persevarence?
#7 aivaruin May 28, 2009 8:40:52	Some Mod should move this thread to Leader section by now. About bardic knowledge. Pick both. Just be sure that you are trained in those skills that are buffed by Knowlege. That way feat bonuses do not overley. And as a human you get one more skill training left open. Judging by your party composition Cunning is the way for you. Human perservance? It seems like decent filler feat. But I dont think you have space for it.
#8 lwr May 28, 2009 9:04:43	Thank you guys for the help. If any of you have any other idea, it's welcome.
#9 lemonfrosted_dup May 28, 2009 9:28:33	With two Defenders up in melée I think Cunning might be the way to go. Also you need to consider weapon choice/power mix. You could stick with the given proficiencies, or grab a superior weapon like a rapier or fullblade. Wait, fullblade? Yes! Just grab Quick Draw for your Implement powers and a nice initiative bonus. Or eschew weapon powers and double-fist wands with Dual Implement Caster, with the off-hand wand holding an encounter utility spell like Jump or Shield. And don't worry: there's more than enough good encounter powers to grab with Adroit Explorer.