We might play 3.0 or 3.5 edition, if anyone rememeber if there was a ninja class and in what book he was? (too lazy to start looking them all up lol)
Our group won't be a powergaming group, so we don't really care if the ninja class was not good, was not optimized... he just want a ninja, because ninja are cool. If he can be simple to understand that a +^^
thanks
Also there is a Assassin article in Dragon that gives you even more options. Like blowgun, garrote, etc.
3.5 has a Ninja class in the Complete Adventurer. Overall, I would say it's like the Rogue class of 3.5, but tweaked and customized to make it "more Ninja". (off the top of my head, ninjas have a "ki strike" type ability that uses ki charges, and might have a defense bonus as long as they have charges of ki left, and they have a "sudden strike" bonus instead of "sneak attack", which doesn't always work exactly the same as the Rogue's sneak attack)
I don't have my 3.5 books with me, but I think that if you're going with a group that doesn't powergame, and where strength/weakness of characters/classes isn't a primary concern, you could probably get away with playing 3.5 and letting him be a Ninja. The books should be cheaper in the idea of "people are selling them as they switch over to 4th edition", but you may have to pay more because they aren't in print anymore. Just a thought.
At the same time, you could play 4e, let him play a Rogue, and then reflavor everything as needed. Purposefully build a character aimed at stealth (or combat, depending on his definition of 'ninja'). Pick Acrobatics as a trained skill, build up Dexterity to boost it, Stealth, and Thievery. Maybe houserule that abilities that work with a crossbow or sling (the "ranged rogue weapons") work with shurikens. (no idea if that's balanced, but the idea is to let him be "more ninja", not screw game balance) Then he can rename his abilities as needed, turning "Piercing Strike" into "Ki Jab", and "Positioning Strike" into "Ninja's Blow", so on and so forth.
Your choice, really. 3.5 Ninja class, or tweak the 4e Rogue as needed? (first allows him to carry his own book to look up his abilities, second allows him to play a class that I would dare say is more likely to be balanced against other classes than the 3.5 Ninja)
Anyway. Back to on topic. I'd have to agree with the others that rogue is just a ninja with a really good cover story. There are utility powers for running around in the open without being seen, for climbing walls without even slowing down, you get to throw shuriken with big damage bonuses (sneak attack), and so on. You name it, a rogue does it.
I dunno what specific traits the Ninja in those 1/2nd edition books were like. But overall the Rogue is a perfect match for a Ninja. He is stealthy, acrobatic, uses daggers, short swords, shurikens, etc.
Also there is a Assassin article in Dragon that gives you even more options. Like blowgun, garrote, etc.
I'd have to agree with Sigil on this one. The rogue is perfect, especially if you take the Aerialist build suggestions from Martial Power. There's all kinds of ninja-y goodness to be had in rogue powers.
Maybe houserule that abilities that work with a crossbow or sling (the "ranged rogue weapons") work with shurikens. (no idea if that's balanced, but the idea is to let him be "more ninja", not screw game balance)
Uh, you know they already do right? Doesn't need a house rule. All of the rogue ranged powers either say light blade or light thrown weapon.
Martial Power gives you an acrobat build for all your crazy leaping skills.
Uh, you know they already do right? Doesn't need a house rule. All of the rogue ranged powers either say light blade or light thrown weapon.
Well, it says "Crossbow, Light Blade, or Sling". It does not say "shuriken". Had I not looked it up in the equipment section, I would not have believed "shurikens" (thrown bolts/stars) were "light blades". I would have counted them as a thrown weapon in it's own category.
But yeah, Shurikens work with almost all Rogue powers in 4e. My bad.
Revision to my previous post. Go with 4e, let him play a Rogue/Ninja. Rogue is his class. Ninja is his background/theme.
Well, it says "Crossbow, Light Blade, or Sling". It does not say "shuriken". Had I not looked it up in the equipment section, I would not have believed "shurikens" (thrown bolts/stars) were "light blades". I would have counted them as a thrown weapon in it's own category.
But yeah, Shurikens work with almost all Rogue powers in 4e. My bad.
Revision to my previous post. Go with 4e, let him play a Rogue/Ninja. Rogue is his class. Ninja is his background/theme.
Don't forget that when a Rogue wields shuriken, they do d6 damage, not d4.
Well, it says "Crossbow, Light Blade, or Sling". It does not say "shuriken". Had I not looked it up in the equipment section, I would not have believed "shurikens" (thrown bolts/stars) were "light blades". I would have counted them as a thrown weapon in it's own category.
They made "shuriken" the the catch-all for small thrown blades, since the technical differences between all the different real-world styles isn't really worth the page space just to have a chart of 1d4, 1d3+1, 1d6-2, and 2d2 damage thrown bits of metal.
Don't forget to multiclass into a spellcaster class so the ninja can have invisibility, teleportation, or whatever mystical goodness the player wants.
Feylock is awesome for that. Take Novice power to get Otherwind Stride (Feylock Enc. 3) because of the awesome teleportation! Plus you can take Arcane Implement Mastery to have your dagger or any light blade (SHURIKEN IMPLEMENT!!!! OMG!) work as your implement.
suggestions?
I want to take this opportunity to say how hilarious I find the idea that the 4e Rogue can be used to make both a Swashbuckler (Pirate) and a Ninja :P
Nothing new about that. Rogues have pretty much always been capable of such in all editions.
Anyway. Avenger also makes a fairly reasonable base class for a ninja build, they even have some built in mystical powers. Ranger is another pretty good choice, if the player wants to duel wield (if they want to stick with light weaponry a hybrid ranger|fighter with the hybrid talent feat for tempest technique works well enough).
Until then, there is always the rogue.
It is not it's own class.
Just because something is asian doesn't make it, it's own class.
4e Hybrid Rogue / Monk
suggestions?
The problem is that monks weren't included in the hybrid playtest, so we have no idea what class features to keep and what to do away with.
My suggestion for the monk class feature would be as follows:
Flurry of Blows (Hybrid)
This class feature functions as the monk class feature except that you can deal the extra damage only when you hit with a monk power or a monk paragon path power.
Anyway, I think monk/rogue is redundant for the idea of making a "ninja" character. A hybrid monk/feylock or rogue/feylock is definitely the way to go.
Character should feel pretty ninja-y even at low levels, and as the build progresses he gets more ninja magic mojo. Consider taking the Shadow Assassin Paragon path, for added deadly ninja assassin feel.
Books you need are PHB 1 and 2, Martial Power, Adventurer's Vault (for the alchemy stuff) and maybe some other books for all of the items, though you can always sub in other equipment. If you don't have PHB 2, just toss Melee Training and Weapon Expertise for other thematically appropriate feats like weapon focus, nimble blade, alertness, or improved initiative. If you don't have martial power just pick different rogue powers, there are plenty of good ones. If you don't have Adventurer's Vault you'll have to do without the alchemy. The build is pretty straightforward and easy to understand, shouldn't give your friend any problems.
====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&DI Character Builder ======
Dr. McNinja, level 10
Human, Rogue
Rogue Tactics: Artful Dodger
Background: Occupation - Criminal
FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 12, Con 10, Dex 20, Int 10, Wis 10, Cha 18.
Starting Ability Scores
Str 12, Con 10, Dex 16, Int 10, Wis 10, Cha 16.
AC: 24 Fort: 19 Reflex: 25 Will: 22
HP: 67 Surges: 6 Surge Value: 16
TRAINED SKILLS
Bluff, Stealth, Thievery, Athletics, Streetwise, Perception, Acrobatics.
FEATS
1: Backstabber
1: Pact Initiate (I'd go with Fey Pact and get the Eyebite ability)
2: Weapon Expertise (Light Blade)
4: Novice Power
6: Alchemist
8: Acolyte Power
10: Melee Training (Dexterity)
POWERS
1, At-Will: Piercing Strike
1, At-Will: Deft Strike
1, Encounter: Fox's Gambit
1, Daily: Blinding Barrage
1, At-Will: Sly Flourish
2, Utility: Fleeting Ghost (retrained to Shadow Veil at Acolyte Power)
3, Encounter: Low Slash (retrained to Otherwind Stride at Novice Power)
5, Daily: Staggering Assault
6, Utility: Nimble Climb
7, Encounter: From the Shadows
9, Daily: Deadly Positioning
10, Utility: Shadow Stride
ITEMS
Alchemy Fun: Smokestick (heroic tier), Blinding Bomb (level 8), Bloodstinger Poison (level 8), Antivenom (heroic tier), Herbal Poultice (level 8)
Other possible items: Sylvan Leather Armor +2 (for bonus to stealth, mostly), Assassin's Shuriken +2, Pact Blade Short sword +2 (for using warlock powers), Safewing Amulet +2 (for always landing on his feet and being able to drop long distances)
====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&DI Character Builder ======
Thanks everyone for the suggestions. I already had the idea of mixing rogue and monk, but I never taught about feylock (but I might need to change the "background" of some abilities since he want a ninja and not a dragon ball caracter shooting energy balls) I'll show him and let him schoose (or I might create one by mixing feylock, rogue, Monk and avenger powers (depending on the time I'll have before hte game start)
I did these for another thread. They may help.
Rogue/Warlock (fey)
Rogue
Avenger/Poisoner
but I never taught about feylock (but I might need to change the "background" of some abilities since he want a ninja and not a dragon ball caracter shooting energy balls)
Sounds cool, reflavoring the feylock shouldn't be that hard. For example, eyebite might be some kind of blinding powder you blow into the target's eyes.
"A Ninja/Rogue that wears cloth or no armor gain a +2 bonus to his AC. This bonus increases to +3 at level 11 and +4 at level 21."
This would have almost no effect on the AC of the character (only affecting what kind of magic armor he could wear), and give him the pajamas his clan requires him to wear.
My only problem, dating back to 1e and just about every iteration since, is that most people want "ninja" to mean uber-godly-kungfu-killing machine. If your friend can get hollywood movies out of his head and use the existing rogue class to craft a sneaky spy/assassin guy, then that is cool. My high school friend's ninja homebrew class was basically a super duper hyper powerful monk. Do NOT let him make something like this.
Just be careful if he wants his ninja to be a combat machine. Ninjas should lose to fighters in straight up combat. They should be about being sneaky, not about killing stuff in droves.
Ninja