| Post/Author/DateTime | Post |
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| #1mosswineAug 23, 2010 4:55:03 | Ok so to start I will write my question so you can read the "Optional" wall of text that comes with the question. My question is if I roll and intimidate and my player teammates object do they have to pass the check to go against me. (The DM was in my favor but acts as a DM more than a personal moderator) Ok so we approach someone who we were supposed to interrogate. I was first to reach him so I roll an intimidate (which passes) and slam him against the wall. The DM and I then exchange vigorous role-playing. I then roll a subdue punch to his face as he cowers beneath me, To my joy it crits!. I then roll another intimidate (which passes) to further enjoy the role-playing aspect of the game. The DM plays along with me and has him pee his pants. In a panic he tries to cast a force spell to push me away....The DM rolls a 1... The spell backfires and knocks him unconscious in his puddle of urine. At this point all of the players are laughing. This is where it irritates me. So myself and the DM are the ONLY people who do role-playing. The other "role-players" have literally no charisma or enthusiasm for the best aspect of the game. So myself and the DM are pretty much all the excitement. So the boring fellow players then ignore my intimidates I rolled on the NPC. So I roll an intimidate on them to let me do my thing. Well it passes and they ignore that too (They even rolled multiple times each and failed)...So they try to subdue me, I am triumphant in that too and should have subdued them. So by some magic (Cheating) they draw their weapons and turn on me. At this point I wanted to kill their characters and make them reroll. But I just submitted...So they have me leave the room. The rogue then locks the door after they CHEAT me out. I wasn't ready to give up on the RP spirit so I roll a lock pick on the door hoping to jam and break the lock. To my joy I roll a 1 and jam them in the room with the unconscious urine covered coward. The rogue then says I cant do that because he locked it and he has 12 ranks in lock picking so I wouldn't even know how to break the lock since he locked it..../FacePalm So they do a very dull role-playing free "talk" with the npc and kills all the excitement that was in the air. I mean it was like they were reading lines from a script that they were forced to read at gunpoint....Actually if there is worse acting than that then that's what I would refer it to. Killed the mood, Killed the fun, Killed the game. So now they say they will attempt to kill my character if I even talk to a NPC. They seem to be all about the rules and playing by them. To my knowledge every single thing I did was within my limitations and they broke pretty much every rule they tried to throw at me. I wanted to know if how I was role-playing was acceptable and if someone tell me the page number of how intimidate works on allies. I have literally every DnD 3.5 book and I couldn't really find anything. The DM is not a petty moderator and want's us to have role-playing interactions between us but this is not what he meant. So I need this information to throw it in their faces and show them that I'm playing by the rules and having fun. Something they seem to be incapable of. |
| #2ashen-lacroixAug 23, 2010 5:51:34 | As far as i know, you can't use intimidate or any related skills on your teammates, just on NPCs. You can't force your teammates to act as you like even if their are ****s. If you don´t like how do they play better change your playing group or something, because people like that tend to ruin the game. |
| #3sallaAug 23, 2010 6:00:23 | As far as i know, you can't use intimidate or any related skills on your teammates, just on NPCs. You can't force your teammates to act as you like even if their are ****s. I agree with both of these points. |
| #4geoffaAug 23, 2010 6:48:42 | This is the sort of thing that needs to get talked through out of character. Have a discussion (or even make some sort of poll) to see how interested each person is in role-playing vs. tactical combat and dice rolling. If everyone else is interested in killing monsters and taking their loot with a minimum of in character role-play, then you are always going to be at odds with the rest of the group. Realize that and either change your play style or go looking for a new group that is more into role-playing. If there's a more even split, then it's up to the DM to try to balance both parts of the game, and each group should have a little bit of patience when you get to the part the other half enjoys. Also, I agree with the previous posters about using bluff and intimidate on other player characters. You have to actually convince them with good ideas or threaten them with credible threats. |
| #5oxybeAug 23, 2010 8:12:52 | the talky skills are used on NPCs and really have no bearing on how players react to any given roll or information given. i mean, otherwise the strongest villain ever would be a diplomonster who would say "hey, i'm awesome" and the party would go "yup" and immediately be zealous fanatics or he'd spout out a badass boast and wind up scaring the party into the next county. the rules exist so the players can influence the world around them, not force each other into doing specific actions. some people, like myself, greatly enjoy eating liver & onions. others don't. Different people play D&D for different reasons. some play it for their faux shakespearean kick. others play it to kick shakespear and others have a "beer and pretzels" style and use D&D as valid an excuse as poker, hockey night, ect... to hang out an just have fun. as others have said, discuss with the group about your playstyle issue and then decide if you're going to stay or say "thanks for the game, but it's not for me" |
| #6thundersteel1918Aug 23, 2010 9:27:09 | The answer is no, you cannot use the "social skills" on players, as players can act or react to anything however they feel. on a side note, according to your story you seem to miraculously succede at everything you attempt, you can intimidate anyone, pick locks, fight peerlessly unarmed, can escape any situation, and apparently subdue multiple player characters at one time. You also want to control the game yourself and just have everyone around just follow and do whatever YOU want. I'd rather have your dull friends in my games than you any day of the week. |
| #7damixmastermikeAug 23, 2010 10:26:19 | on a side note, according to your story you seem to miraculously [succeed] at everything you attempt, you can intimidate anyone, pick locks, fight peerlessly unarmed, can escape any situation, and apparently subdue multiple player characters at one time. You also want to control the game yourself and just have everyone around just follow and do whatever YOU want. I'd rather have your dull friends in my games than you any day of the week. I was going to say type this exact thing as I was reading the thread. I agree with everyone else that you cannot use social skills on PCs. In my group, when you use one on an NPC, it works and helps but our DMs (myself and this other dude) force you to role play or at least say what your character would say. The dice roll (intimidate or diplomacy) suppliment your role-playing depending on what you rolled. On occasion in extreme circumstances I have allowed social skill rolles between PCs but the what the PC using the skills was doing/saying was vastly more important at the time. |
| #8jetshieldAug 23, 2010 10:48:07 | The answer is no, you cannot use the "social skills" on players, as players can act or react to anything however they feel. this |
| #9balogthefierceAug 23, 2010 11:27:26 | As the above posters have mentioned generally you can't use social skills on other PCs. While the mechanics support this kind of behavior, they also equally don't suppot it. Generally though if party members start using skills or abilities to 'force' other PCs to behave a certain way something is amiss. As a DM I'd allow a player to do this, but it probably wouldn't do much. "I roll intimidate against the Wizard" "Ok", "I rolled a "34", to the Wizard "Your friend comes at you shouting and looking pretty scary." That's the extent of what that skill could do for you. All that aside, we come to the portion of the post you're not going to want to hear, but it's the honest part and needs to be laid out.
That majority of the above are opinions. You never explain how the other players are cheating, what are they fuding dice rolls? Not writing down the correct amount of damage when they get hit? Not keep track of negative modifiers? Not check off when they use their dailies? For us on teh intrawebz, we have no idea except for you're word. Next things like "They're ruining the best aspect of the game!!" Is total and complete and utter HOGWASH. It is the best and most fun aspect of the game, for YOU. It appears the same may be true for your DM, the other players at the table may have more fun playing the tactical combat side of the game, or have more fun when they explore something new, or have more fun when they uncover a major plot point that moves the stroy along. You need to get it out of your head that you're playstyle is the gospel for the group. It's unfair to them. Heck, it's even posted in the title of this thread. You need to change the mentality about the rest of the group, or simply stop playing with the group. Your friends (I'm assuming these are friends but it's honestly difficult to tell from how you talk about them) may not be actors, maybe they're trying to do the best they can, or they're muddling through a section of the game they consider boring and are waiting to hear the magic "Roll initative". I'm not trying to rag on you (well maybe a little, but you need it) I'm trying to help you change your idea about the game and the group you're playing with so that everyone at the table is having fun. I hope your DM also understands this principle, from the reading it sounds like he's siding with you, if this continues I predict that your gaming group will dissolve, that means no D&D for any of you if you can't get yourselves sorted out. I hope your DM asks for a critique and how and what people enjoyed about each session, and tailors himself to that feedback. Good luck, and try to reflect a little and find out what the other players enjoy about the game as well or, just get together a play Scrabble. |
| #10mosswineAug 23, 2010 13:26:38 | I see you're complaining that I didn't explain their side of the story. Why would I do that? I mean this is my forum post not the Groups forum post. It's absurd that you people are acting as if I"M childish because I use MY opinion in MY post. I mean I made it for MY GAIN not for the improvement of the uncharismatic boring players. I'm completely aware that I'm being selfish by trying to find some rule to make them either RP or stand aside. And as for the "cheating" I would assume when someone rolls something and it isn't high enough to pass a check so they just keep rerolling it until the DM has to say "Hey you didn't beat it" yeah I would consider that cheating. And yes I did beat the other 3 players at a grapple they were all casters with obviously no strength Modifiers and I was the tank. We all rolled against each other individually and I was the luckier of the rollers. On top of that their characters are right out of the 3.5 handbook and mine is from a supplement book and I have feats from various books and they also don't update their characters every level. Some haven’t even updated them at all. I just thought people would relate that taking the ROLE-PLAYING out of a RPg defeats the purpose of the game. |
| #11damixmastermikeAug 23, 2010 14:18:08 | I disagree that your group is defeating the purpose of the game. The game is what you make of it:Different people play D&D for different reasons. some play it for their faux shakespearean kick. others play it to kick shakespear and others have a "beer and pretzels" style and use D&D as valid an excuse as poker, hockey night, ect... to hang out an just have fun. Your way of playing is just so radically different from the other PCs that you're not enjoying yourself. Someone suggested speaking to your DM about this or finding another group; I would try both in that order. |
| #12mosswineAug 23, 2010 14:28:48 | Well it's just they don't know all of the basic combat rules, character development, or the large variety of feats and classes outside of the handbook. Aside from the strict no RP code they seem to follow they also mutter and role their eyes during combat because they didn't know what a Full Round attack was and assumed I was cheating. When I tell them it's because I downloaded all the 3.5 books and read em they just act as if I'm cheating for bringing flavor to my character and my girlfriends. For example she is a ranger she uses the move "ranged pin" As soon as she uses the move the most uncharismatic of the bunch yells "I call shenanigans". I tell him it's from a book outside of the PHB and he says "if it's not in the book it can't be used". So I glare at him and mutter "whoever said Ignorance is bliss is an idiot" and begrudgingly continue combat. It's like that literally every combat phase even though last session I went and printed the pages with all of my feats and my girl friends feats and they still seem to think we are somehow cheating. Also I didn't clarify that it's more than myself that enjoys some RP. My gf, my best friend, the DM, and myself love the rp and are informed in combat as well. The other three players think we are idiots to think that a RPG means you Role Play and have skimmed the PHB maybe once. I mean being boring is one thing but them thinking every single action I do is a cheat because they are misinformed it's annoying and ruins my game and their game. The one who I constantly butt heads with is in charge of the groups gold (we keep it as one total and talk to the others if we need to buy something) he seems pretty bent on making sure the Rp'ers can't see the total and in fact I'm not even able enter the town near our dungeon or he will alarm the guards. (The dm doesn't jump in since he is a DM not a baby sitter). The boring half of teh group also hoards all potions and equipment and sells the stuff before asking if the Rp'ers even need any of the spoils we have found. What's stupid is they even sell equipment that would have been an upgrade....Oh wait one of them has amassed a collection of 4 basic longswords for some reason. Honestly I don't know where I'm going with this forum and want to know what I could do to persuade them. Because I am DM next and I will have my revenge if they keep being sticks in the mud. |
| #13silverdragonnAug 23, 2010 16:06:21 | Get a new group if you don't like this one. Seriously, why are they playing if, by your description and account, they don't seem to enjoy themselves, in either a combat or a social situation? |
| #14LordOfWeaselsAug 23, 2010 16:20:14 | It's absurd that you people are acting as if I"M childish because I use MY opinion in MY post. No, we're acting as if you're childish because you're being childish. Accusations of cheating? Rolling Intimidate against other players to force them to obey you? Extravagant declarations that revenge is coming? Yeah. Quit. You don't belong in that game, and everyone, you included, will be happier if you stop playing. |
| #15mosswineAug 23, 2010 16:42:44 | Ok so I make a post...regarding myself...and MY experience...and how it effects ME. Notice a theme here, "Smart Guy". I didn't make this to better the experience of the players who I share an equal animosity towards right now. I made this to get insight on persuading them to play the game how myself and the dm would "LIKE" it to be played. So that way there would be less conflict between the players and MYSELF. They are not accusations of cheating it was blatant cheating that everyone was aware of. I mean what kind of world do you live in where there is no such thing as revenge, frustration, selfishness and resentment. Sounds like you need to do some growing up if you think mature people don't have those feelings too. Then to add to your "intelligent" and "Insightful" statement you toss in some hypocrisy. Telling me I am too childish to play and I should quit. Your suggest right there is possibly the most childish way to approach the situation. Thanks you are just such a wonderful and well informed person. I bet all 3,600 of your posts weren't ignorant in the slightest. |
| #16damixmastermikeAug 23, 2010 16:51:49 | They are not accusations of cheating it was blatant cheating that everyone was aware of. Just curious then Moss, what did the DM do? |
| #17mosswineAug 23, 2010 16:54:05 | He sighed and said "Look you guys didn't out roll him on your first rolls" |
| #18sallaAug 23, 2010 17:11:34 | Ok so I make a post...regarding myself...and MY experience...and how it effects ME. Notice a theme here, "Smart Guy". I didn't make this to better the experience of the players who I share an equal animosity towards right now. I made this to get insight on persuading them to play the game how myself and the dm would "LIKE" it to be played. So that way there would be less conflict between the players and MYSELF. It's not all about you. |
| #19vellisAug 23, 2010 17:22:00 |
You should have opened with this, you come across as a raging jack ass in your earlier posts =p As far as what to do, if you haven't tried a mature conversation with the other party yet, that's where you start. Honestly it sounds like you're completely incompatible with the other half of your group. If you can't work out a solution that both parties will enjoy, then it sounds like you have enough people to start a smaller group that focuses more on roleplay. |
| #20balogthefierceAug 23, 2010 17:31:38 |
Oh no, those things certainly exist in my world, just ask my ex-girlfriend! Bum da Bum *cymbol crash* I just don't have them going on between the PLAYERS at my gaming table. When these issues start to come out I stamp them out immediatly, repeat offenders get the boot from the group, or I switch game types that we're playing so that everyone is playing a game they will enjoy. From what I'm reading about your group and the attitude you have adopted to fixing the problems I can only guess that... Your gaming group will be disbanding in 5.....4....3.... |
| #21LordOfWeaselsAug 23, 2010 17:42:47 |
Our impression of you: not improving. |
| #22shadow_viperAug 23, 2010 18:12:09 |
Mature people control(or attempt to control) those feelings so they don't become a problem. D&D is a cooperative game, each player needs to work together to ensure that everyone is having as much fun as possible. Your fun is not more important than anyone else's in the group, nor is another's fun more important that your's. However, the group majority's fun is more important than your individual fun. If you attempt to "teach them a lesson" the next time it's your turn to DM, you should expect that it will be the last time your group allows you to DM. |
| #23ORC_ChaosAug 23, 2010 18:48:28 | Due to complaints received about this thread, I've closed it. The thread will be reviewed to determine if it should be permanently closed, re-opened, and/or a new thread or threads created in its place. |