Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 case_w. Aug 08, 2009 2:07:25	Is there anything (an item, feat, skill trick, spell, etc.) that can give you a save against a spell that has Saving Throw = None? Thanks! Case
#2 kouk Aug 08, 2009 3:44:29	This is of course a 3.5 question I believe?
#3 salla Aug 08, 2009 3:45:59	This is of course a 3.5 question I believe? Yes, it is. The answer to said question is 'no'.
#4 kouk Aug 08, 2009 6:43:04	I'd be hesitant to call it a categorical "no," because there's so much dang stuff printed for 3.5 nobody can ever really be sure :P But, it's exceedingly rare at the very least.
#5 alexii Aug 08, 2009 14:50:55	Its very rare and almost unheard of. This is because almost any spell has a defence of some sort- whether it is Touch AC, HD, Saving Throw, a Grapple Modifier (telekinesis), Spell Resistance or even something as obscure as race. One of the worst I can think of is forcecage, but even that doesn't leave you totally defenceless. However- if you are seeking to gain particular potency against spellcasters- make sure you have enough rogue or monk levels to have evasion (or if you don't want to sacrifice your high BAB class too much wear a ring of evasion) and you could always seek a way to earn the awesome METTLE as well (works similar to evasion for fort and will effects). The combination of these spells make damage dealing spellcasters cry. Off the top of my head, a Kensai from Complete Warrior with a ring of Evasion is extremely good at this.
#6 case_w. Aug 08, 2009 15:06:52	This is for 3.5. My character has amazing saves with improved evasion and the epic feats Dextrous Fortitude, Dextrous Will and Epic Dodge. I even have the luck domain that allows me to reroll a save 1/day if needed (worships Tymora, goddess of luck). Unfortunately, a massive Balor casts greater dispel magic on me and wiped out almost all of my buffs including death ward. His next action the following round was to use his blasphemy or blasphemy ability which instantly killed me with no save (I have no SR). I know there are items I can get to help with death magic but I remember reading somewhere about getting a save even when you normally wouldn't. Unfortunately, that was awhile ago and I don't remember where I read it. Thank you for any insight you may have. Case
#7 alexii Aug 08, 2009 15:16:33	I can give you insight- I suspect your DM's an ass. Was it a targeted dispel on you, or a area of effect. Because an area of effect one can only strip you of one of your effects or none. And a targeted one can strip you of all of them- but he is rolling d20+20 (max) at a DC of 11+ your caster level on EACH dispel check. It sounds like your a cleric, but even if you only have a measly caster level of say 15 (and your into epic levels, cmon), hes still failing against DC26 on a 5 or lower- thats one in 4 effects failed to dispel. There MAY be something in Kensai about making concentration checks to resist a spell's effects- i'll check it up for you because its worded similarily.
#8 kouk Aug 08, 2009 16:13:15	Insight from another perspective might be that the DM is frustrated at being unable to hit your character with anything BUT no save effects.
#9 case_w. Aug 08, 2009 16:27:56	LOL, I believe you may be correct.
#10 keyes2k4 Aug 08, 2009 16:30:14	Nothing specific to what you're saying comes to mind; however if you take immediate action abilities such as abrupt jaunt (CM) which allows a specialist wizard to teleport 10' as an immediate action, then you could potentially claim to avoid having to save all together. an example of this would be teleporting behind a wall when a ray spell is aimed at you, or out of the area of the fog cloud that just enveloped a nearby ally.
#11 case_w. Aug 08, 2009 18:26:10	. Was it a targeted dispel on you, or a area of effect. Because an area of effect one can only strip you of one of your effects or none.... Alexi, It was a targeted dispel magic. I am mostly a scout but have a few levels of a cleric and rogue and even 1 level of wizard. The spell "Death Ward Mass" was cast on me by a 31st level cleric. Nothing specific to what you're saying comes to mind; however if you take immediate action abilities such as abrupt jaunt (CM) which allows a specialist wizard to teleport 10' as an immediate action, then you could potentially claim to avoid having to save all together. an example of this would be teleporting behind a wall when a ray spell is aimed at you, or out of the area of the fog cloud that just enveloped a nearby ally. Keyes, it's good thought but it would never fly with my DM. I guess I need to get an item or enchantment to protect myself from death magic. Being mazed or forcecaged isn't looking so bad after dieing instantly
#12 alexii Aug 08, 2009 20:48:15	... 31st Level Cleric... You realise that with a Greater Dispel its a D20+20, capped at +20. So your DM claims he beat a DC of 42 (11+ the caster level of the person who cast the spell) with a D20 PLUS 20... and multiple times to boot? Seems my initial reaction was correct.
#13 case_w. Aug 09, 2009 19:15:31	... 31st Level Cleric... You realise that with a Greater Dispel its a D20+20, capped at +20. So your DM claims he beat a DC of 42 (11+ the caster level of the person who cast the spell) with a D20 PLUS 20... and multiple times to boot? Seems my initial reaction was correct. The Balor rolled a verified natural 20 to remove that spell. We've been playing a variant rule that on a to hit or save, a natural 1 isn't always a miss/fail and a natural 20 isn't always a hit/save. You must roll a 2nd d20 and subtract (on a 1) or add (on a 20) the 2nd d20 to get your end result. Bad luck for me. Game play stopped there so I'm hoping my cleric can revivify me before the Balor's next turn.
#14 emmerask Aug 10, 2009 2:59:00	... 31st Level Cleric... You realise that with a Greater Dispel its a D20+20, capped at +20. So your DM claims he beat a DC of 42 (11+ the caster level of the person who cast the spell) with a D20 PLUS 20... and multiple times to boot? Seems my initial reaction was correct. It depends ;) if you use open ended variant rule it is perfectly possible ;) ie if you roll a 20 continue to roll and add I don´t recall any abilitie or item that lets you get a save against a spell without saves celerity and casting wall of stone/force or something like that would have helped though And at that level you really should have something against death effects in 3.5 ;)
#15 alexii Aug 10, 2009 12:40:14	Even on the natural 20, thats a SINGLE buff removed not all of them.
#16 Zherog Aug 10, 2009 13:14:10	That roll was for a caster level check, though. Not a save. Under standard rules, a natural 20 wouldn't guarantee success, so the variant "roll another" method shouldn't be used.
#17 chaosturtle Aug 10, 2009 14:19:01	I wouldn't say it was the DM being an ass, more just a misunderstanding of the rules on his part.