Our (fairly unexperienced) DM seems to want to be a player more than he wants to be a DM. We are a fairly light-hearted group so we try to let it go, but it gets a little annoying. He made a DMPC rogue. We play through, kill a monster in the first round, then his DMPC goes. He buries himself behind his screen, and while we spend ten minutes talking about Monty Python and the Holy Grail, we hear from behind the screen:
48...let's see that's plus 12...woah, really? Wait, no...guys, be quiet! I'm trying to concentrate! Hmm...let's see...
five minutes later he immerges, announces that he does 100 damage (we're level 11) and kills the monster. This stupid DMPC just made mince meat out of a monster we could have had fun killing ourselves. We've seriously discussed pretending the DMPC is a double agent and killing him in his sleep.
Then, as if to prove that he is way more into his DMPC than DMing, he (our DM) says, "OK, now it's your turn."
Me: Um...aren't the monsters supposed to go?
DM: Oh, right.
Me: /facepalm
What are we supposed to do?
Speak to the other players and see what their opinions on the matter is. If they feel they same way as you then speak to the DM. Let him know that you don't like the DMPC hogging the spotlight. Plus he shouldn't be taking 15 minutes for a turn.
Also, why does he have a DMPC in the first place? Is it filling a hole in the group? Not enough people?
DMPC's can be great but it sounds like the one in your game is going to cause a lot of problems.
Be civil and talk to the DM first. If that doesn't help tie the rogue up and leave him somewhere. If he continues to hog the spotlight just keep all of your characters back and don't help the rogue.
If the DM doesn't get the message after that, go ahead and off the character.
But I'd hold off on killing the character until you have exhausted all other options.
I absolutelty can sympathise with you. I had a DM once that basically created monsters that he felt would be fun for his DMPC to deal with. In some cases they would have weakness which his "npc" would have just the answer for. The character always seemed to be present and really stole a lot of the attention and fun from the actual players.
In our case we simply had an honest discussion with the DM , where we said "hey , you really seem to enjoy that character, why not just turn the reigns over to someone so you can really devote all your time to him ( which frankly he had already done anyway for all intents and purposes) and let someone else DM.
I'm here to add to the advice above: have a nice, civil, calm and even toned conversation with your DM.
Keep in mind that being inexperienced means that there is a lot he is still learning, like lesson #1 - you cannot be a DM if you insist on having a character that is "yours." If your group's party "needs" a rogue and none of the players want to play a rogue, or take the rogue on as a secondary character run by the player's as a commity - then it is time for the DM to remove the "need" for a rogue. Likewise with other characters.
Also keep in mind that not everyone is actually capable of being a "good" DM - some are only passable, and some are just too obsessed with being a player to be able to manage. If your DM wants to be a player this much - then it's time for the group to find a DM that will let them all be players, or for one of you that thinks you could manage being a DM to take on that role and allow the current DM his desired player-dom.
...most "bad," DMs I have ever met were only "bad," because their players early on in their DMing career let them have their way - if you find yourself saying "well, he is our DM," then it's time for you to grow a pair (figuratively) and start saying "wait, we are all in this for fun - and we should have equal say in things so that everyone's fun is treated equally."
I would bet that your DM thinks that everything is completely awesome, and has no idea that anything he is doing is lessening the fun you are having - because you have not told him that it is.
Our (fairly unexperienced) DM seems to want to be a player more than he wants to be a DM.
What are we supposed to do?
Ask him if he wants to be a player, and play that rogue.
If he does . . . try and find someone else willing to DM.
If he does not . . . explain why you are finding the DMPC a problem.
Talk with the DM first and give a list of the complaints you have about the situation. It worked last time I had to deal with a DMNPC like that.
Of course, this was after the players had decided to vent their frustrations on the NPC and had tied her up, chained her up, shoved her in a barrel, shoved that barrel in a barrel full of gunpowder, chained the barrel closed and then dropped in front of a large number of canon loaded with explosive shot.
I'd definitely agree with Aaron, being a DM myself, my perspective on what is fun and what isn't, is different from my groups. Sometimes I just don't see when an event happens which annoys the hell out of my group, telling your DM outside of the game is your best bet in that situation.
After that I would suggest a new system for bringing along DM controlled characters. We use mercenaries in my game, they're characters who are designed around builds either I or my players are interested in seeing, but since the players have to hire them they are in control of when such characters enter or leave the party; and they also are in control of the character in battle so they can evaluate new builds without having to switch characters.
Kill the DMPC!
Talk with the DM first and give a list of the complaints you have about the situation. It worked last time I had to deal with a DMNPC like that.Of course, this was after the players had decided to vent their frustrations on the NPC and had tied her up, chained her up, shoved her in a barrel, shoved that barrel in a barrel full of gunpowder, chained the barrel closed and then dropped in front of a large number of canon loaded with explosive shot.
I thought you guys said that game never happened?
I've had to deal with so many Mary Sue DMPCs that I started getting utterly passive-aggressive with 'em. The fight would break out, and me and the rest of the PCs would set up a picnic in the back ranks.
"Who, us? Help you? Good heavens, no. You're so much more powerful and competent than we are, we'd just get in your way."
A post I've made in other simular threads:
DMPCs can work out quite well if done correctly.
In the Campaign that I DM(3.5), my two brothers and I each control two characters, so I have two DMPCs.
These two characters are treated as just another member of the adventuring party with a few exceptions.
1) They usually never give advice unless asked and I am always careful with DM knowledge vs character knowledge. But they also have opinions and will occasionally express them. For example, one of my DMPCs loves forests, so when an adventure/task is completed and the discussion of "where to next" comes up: he will suggest traveling to and exploring a nearby forest. Even if I have nothing planned for that forest(they each still have a personality after-all, as any other character would). Samething goes for my other DMPC(who will likely have an opposite(of the forest explorer) opinion of where he'd like to visit.) Ultimately the decisions are up to the adventuring party as a whole, with each character having an equal vote. (I try to run more of an open-ended campaign). With that said they only offer advice/opinions to problems/puzzles/etc when/if asked.
2) When in combat and in certain situations, I decide where a DMPC is going to position himself and then roll randomly for a planned hidden monster's location. Example: The DMPC climbs up one tree out of a possible six to get a better view of the situation/area, I then roll a 1d6 to place the hidden monster within a tree. Rather than deciding which tree the hidden monster will be in before hand.
3) If a DMPC goes off to do something on his own, it's done so 'off screen' or simply explained with a brief description(where appropriate).
Other than that the two DMPCs are just another member of the adventuring party, loot is divided up equally, as is exp(the six characters all pretty much get the same exp and stay the same level, less headaches that way). The DMPCs never get any special treatment because they're a DMPC, I treat them as I would any other PC. I also stay 'on guard' for subconcious favortisim.
So far this is working out great. And each of us still get to be players even if we're DMing.
DMPCs can work out quite well if done correctly.
And there in lies the problems. Too many DM's who use them, abuse them. Too often an unexperienced DM will freak out about having a 3 or 4 PC party, and they can't figure out to adjust the adventure/encounters to work for a short party, so enter stage left DMPC Mary Sue.This causes lots of problems, the largest being that it's really just too damn easy to make adventure/encounter appropriate for party size and inserting DMPC is a copout for doing the extra work to scale down.
DMPCs can work out quite well if done correctly.
And there in lies the problems. Too many DM's who use them, abuse them. Too often an unexperienced DM will freak out about having a 3 or 4 PC party, and they can't figure out to adjust the adventure/encounters to work for a short party, so enter stage left DMPC Mary Sue.This causes lots of problems, the largest being that it's really just too damn easy to make adventure/encounter appropriate for party size and inserting DMPC is a copout for doing the extra work to scale down.
Which if why I offered the above advice, it has worked for my group quite well.
Really, DMPCs aren't necessarily a bad thing.
Kill the DMPC!
Yes!
That's the way to go. We had a Dm that always had his DMPC save the day, so eventualy we all got sick of it and we all started attcking him, ended up killing him! Yes! The DM took the hint and never pulled that crap again.
I am onboard the "Kill the DMPC Express" also...I was invited to join a group in which the DM was running a PC and I thought, "OK, I don't like it but I'll see how he does..." After 4 hours of play I vowed "never again!" Not only was the DM a PC, he was "the" PC...he was the leader of the group, had his own "quest" that he was leading everyone else on, and had made his best friend an extraordinarily powerful character.
I sat in amazement as all the other people in the group watched these two do "evening at the improv" for 4 hours while they had virtually nothing to do with the action. Yuck.
I am onboard the "Kill the DMPC Express" also...I was invited to join a group in which the DM was running a PC and I thought, "OK, I don't like it but I'll see how he does..." After 4 hours of play I vowed "never again!" Not only was the DM a PC, he was "the" PC...he was the leader of the group, had his own "quest" that he was leading everyone else on, and had made his best friend an extraordinarily powerful character.
I sat in amazement as all the other people in the group watched these two do "evening at the improv" for 4 hours while they had virtually nothing to do with the action. Yuck.
Nothing says inexperienced, clueless DM like the DMPC. If the DM HAS to have another character in the party to fill a necessary hole, it should most definitely be a NPC, not a DMPC. Big difference. The NPC should be no more important to the DM than any other NPC with a lot of "Screen Time." Recurring villians, Joe the Bartender at the Tavern the PC's frequent, the kindly Priest at the local Temple who aids the party on occasion, etc.
Years ago, I was running for a group in which absolutely NOONE wanted to play a cleric. Period. So, I would throw in a NPC cleric. Because I dislike anything smacking of a DMPC, and because I wanted to encourage someone to actually TRY playing a cleric, I amused myself by always offing, or otherwise getting rid of the NPC after two or three adventures. Usually, they would die horrible and gruesome deaths. Or, they might be seduced and kidnapped by a Nymph. Get married. Suffer from Spontaneous Human Combustion...
After a while, this got kind of predictable, and since my players were still recalcitrant, I created an NPC Healer Class, an idea from an old Dragon Magazine article. Franklin the Healer, while he became an important member of the party and a well developed character, was still just an NPC and absolutely NEVER outshined the party. After a while, he left to pursue his own agenda. I intended to bring him back for a few sessions as part of the storyline, but the game took a radically different turn and this never happened. As for the party, I decided not to give them another NPC, and they just had to tough it out for a while. A year or so later, a new player joined who was quite willing to play a cleric.
Having an NPC travelling with the party, whether as "Members," Henchman, rescued damsels, or just someone along for the ride can be fun for the DM, offering opportunities for Role-Playing and sometimes to drop an important hint or clue. But if the DM wants to play, then s/he needs to play, not try to have their cake and eat it to by running a "DMPC."
In my opinion, you're either a DM or you're a PC. I have no problem with NPC's, but there's a fine line between a DM running an NPC for the party & that character being a full-fledged DMPC.
Some might say they're the same & that its all just semantics, but to me a DM-run NPC should be treated like a hireling. He does what he's told to do, offers opinions when asked, and gets his fair share of the treasure, including items if its for the betterment of the party as a whole.
A DMPC, otoh, is one that acts, speaks, and thinks for itself. He has his own motives, whether the coincide with the bulk of the party of not. Essentially, the DMPC is a "sentient" character, whereas the DM-run NPC should be run more like a 'bot. There should be exceptions, of course, such as "the infiltrator"...a DMPC posing as a helpful NPC for the purpose of luring the party into some form of trap, for the purpose of adventure & good storytelling (the natural conclusion being that the DMPC does get killed).
That's all my opinion, anyway.
But as far as killing the DMPC outright or even leaving him to fend for himself during battle...look, he's run by the DM. The DM is essentially god when it comes to D&D. He can decide to do whatever he wants, whether it be declaring your Crit vs him null & void ("Ha ha! I dodged!") or simply deciding his DMPC is secretly a deity in humanoid form ("I'm actually the goddess known as the Raven Queen & I'm here for your souls...you're all dead!"). Talking to your DM would be the best bet. Even if he refuses to relent, consider this...as long as you're playing in his game, he can do whatever he wants to you, but he can't do anything if you don't play in his game. So essentially, if you're mean to his PC, he'll take it out on your PC's. But if you talk to him & he still can't separate his PC from his job as DM, just leave the group & you won't have to worry about retaliation.
Talk with the other players, reach a consensus, and then, as a group, talk with the DM. If the DMPC is reducing the fun of the group, it has to go. I had the same problem once when someone brought "lite beer" instead of a real lager or ale. That matter too was able to be resolved through discussion and diplomacy rather than bloodshed 
As a DM, I can say my experience with DMPC's is that they are a PITA. Whether "hirelings", NPC's, DMPC's or whatever other name you want to give them. You're already running every villian, farmer, tavern wench, and wandering monster in the game. Trying to play on the characters side is like playing a game of chess with yourself. Yes, it can be done, but it makes my poor brain hurt.
I think my first one was Elmo the 4th level ranger in the Village of Hommlet (with his trusty sidekick, the "big axe").This in a party of 1st and 2nd level characters... The results were less than spectacular. However, that is the stuff experience is made of.
I am onboard the "Kill the DMPC Express" also...I was invited to join a group in which the DM was running a PC and I thought, "OK, I don't like it but I'll see how he does..." After 4 hours of play I vowed "never again!" Not only was the DM a PC, he was "the" PC...he was the leader of the group, had his own "quest" that he was leading everyone else on, and had made his best friend an extraordinarily powerful character.
I sat in amazement as all the other people in the group watched these two do "evening at the improv" for 4 hours while they had virtually nothing to do with the action. Yuck.
WOOT! WOOT!
Our (fairly unexperienced) DM seems to want to be a player more than he wants to be a DM. We are a fairly light-hearted group so we try to let it go, but it gets a little annoying. He made a DMPC rogue. We play through, kill a monster in the first round, then his DMPC goes. He buries himself behind his screen, and while we spend ten minutes talking about Monty Python and the Holy Grail, we hear from behind the screen:
48...let's see that's plus 12...woah, really? Wait, no...guys, be quiet! I'm trying to concentrate! Hmm...let's see...
five minutes later he immerges, announces that he does 100 damage (we're level 11) and kills the monster. This stupid DMPC just made mince meat out of a monster we could have had fun killing ourselves. We've seriously discussed pretending the DMPC is a double agent and killing him in his sleep.
Then, as if to prove that he is way more into his DMPC than DMing, he (our DM) says, "OK, now it's your turn."
Me: Um...aren't the monsters supposed to go?
DM: Oh, right.
Me: /facepalm
What are we supposed to do?
So, I'm curious if this was ever resolved? Did you take our advice and kill the stupid DMPC?