If you prefer one of:
A) Standard PHB point buy
B) Standard PHB arrays
C) Standard PHB rolling method
Would you still go to a game using one of the other methods? How much would it hurt your interest?
(There are so many possible homebrew variants that its difficult to consider them all, so let's try to stick to the official variants only).
Given those 3, I'd be happiest with point buy. I'd play a standard array without complaint. PHB rolls...er...well, that's two strikes against the game right there. Not only do I not like it, but I think that choosing that method tends to indicate a lack of general understanding of D&D 4e. That's not necessarily true, but its a big enough indicator to make me worry. I'd probably decline a random stat game.
4th ED? Some level of point buy or I'm gone. The game actually has a semblance of ballance and reason and I see no reason to toss that out.
That said, I have played in rolled stat games before. However, they were all 3.5, so any disparity of power is just as likely to be because of caster/noncaster issues as because of stat generation (hence, my totemist died his first day in WLD, but the Druid is going strong in ST).
I absolutely do not touch Gygaxian stat generation.
That being said, I like my gourp enough that if they insisted on me rolling form now on I would still play. But because they are fine with me doing point buy is one of the reasons I like to play with them.
Both the people in the group that like to DM also like to put racial/class restrictions on what we can play for plot setting reasons. In our current campaign everyone had to be human, halfling, or genesai and could chose any class for human and from about 5 classes each for halfling and genesai. But I am ok with that since they still give me a couple to chose from and so far there has always been at least one I was interested in and usually more than one.
Alternately, I'd probably roll and just 'happen' to come up with a 22 point buy.
Would you still go to a game using one of the other methods? How much would it hurt your interest?
Yes, I would.
(I prefer point buy).
It would not hurt my interest.
love,
malkav
As it is I should be able to use homebrew stuff from dnd wiki or what I invented. You won't know if it's balanced till you try it out!
worst generation method (and i honestly kid you not here) i've played with: 4d6, reroll 1s, drop lowest, 2nd lowest becomes a 6. minimum stat is a 10. average is 13.
i like powerful characters... but EACH CHARACTER had at least 2 18s! it was ridiculous. i didn't mind it, but it still left a sour taste in my mouth as virtually nothing was ever a challenge.
keep it just slightly above average (somewhere between an overall +7 to +9 through all scores is perfect in my books) and i'm happy, as long as i get to play the character i want.
We've already got a whole point buy vs. rolling debate raging in a different thread. I'd like to ask about something a little different here.
If you prefer one of:
A) Standard PHB point buy
B) Standard PHB arrays
C) Standard PHB rolling method
Would you still go to a game using one of the other methods? How much would it hurt your interest?
(There are so many possible homebrew variants that its difficult to consider them all, so let's try to stick to the official variants only).
Given those 3, I'd be happiest with point buy. I'd play a standard array without complaint. PHB rolls...er...well, that's two strikes against the game right there. Not only do I not like it, but I think that choosing that method tends to indicate a lack of general understanding of D&D 4e. That's not necessarily true, but its a big enough indicator to make me worry. I'd probably decline a random stat game.
I prefer point buy but currently play in a group that rolled there stats.
Im a hair sub par but these are my best friends so it's cool.
in the game i run i allow then to roll also .. again best friends so there you have it, but in a pick up game at a con or such I would push for point buy.
and i know people whom if if they played with me I would at least watch them roll.
Array is boring. I'd rather not, but I can't say it would drive me from a game.
Rolling is fun under certain conditions. I won't do "straight down" rolls of any type. I prefer at least a measure of consideration by the DM on all rolling, however. And a system that allows you to have a say in where the rolls go.
Why do I like rolling? It feels more organic and after a while of point buy, all the characters start looking the same. Sure there can be problems with rolling. Characters can be over/under powered, but that's why the DM should over see creation for rolling. Additionally, a good DM knows the balance and feel of the system well enough to make the right adjustments as needed. Play lean on the magic items, or toss in a few more than normal. Pad encounters properly. Whatever they deem fit and/or necessary. But like I said good DMs make all the difference.
Like I said above though, point buy is my general preference and it's best for the game in a sense of development and balanced design, however I hope that there's always room for die rolled stats in the proper game environment.
Arrays: Fine.
Standard Array: Still ok.
4d6 Roll: here's where I start getting nervous.
3d6 roll, in-order roll, etc: back away slowly.
I've had bad experiences with rolling, so I'm always hesitant to deal with it again. The last time my group used it, one of the experienced players rolled nothing lower than a 14 (in front of the DM), while the newbie took three tries before she got finally a set that (barely) passed the "too crappy, reroll" rule. There's a reason it was the last time we rolled.
The standard arrays are certainly within reason, and standard rolling is tolerably fine, but if things get weird, I'll be cautious, at the very least.
YES.
I do have a fondness for rolling stats.
I am perfectly willing (and more than able) to play whatever fate may give me. I don't care if that's Average-Man, Mediocre+ Guy, Uber PC, or MR...special. So, if allowed, I will roll my stats.
Once I have the stats, then I'll happily start crafting/playing out this particular PCs story.
But really, beyond simply knowing wich method(s) will be used for a game?
I don't worry about it.
It's a real simple answer:
YES.
I do have a fondness for rolling stats.
I am perfectly willing (and more than able) to play whatever fate may give me. I don't care if that's Average-Man, Mediocre+ Guy, Uber PC, or MR...special. So, if allowed, I will roll my stats.
Once I have the stats, then I'll happily start crafting/playing out this particular PCs story.
But really, beyond simply knowing wich method(s) will be used for a game?
I don't worry about it.
I'm exactly the same way, I don't care what generation method is used so long as the game is interesting. I'll build my character out of what ever is given to me.
I started out with the rolling method and it's got a special place in my heart because of it. I won't back away if the DM wants us to roll for em'.
I'm okay with point buy, and I can cope with using a set array, though the latter is my least preferred method.
We've already got a whole point buy vs. rolling debate raging in a different thread. I'd like to ask about something a little different here.
If you prefer one of:
A) Standard PHB point buy
B) Standard PHB arrays
C) Standard PHB rolling method
Would you still go to a game using one of the other methods? How much would it hurt your interest?
I consider A and B to be the same ting since the Standard Array matches the point buy arrays. That said, I'll keep them apart for the exercise. A would be my preference, though I'd have no issues playing in a group that said "Standard array, live with it." Rolling... eh, I'd play the game. It would probably hurt my interests a bit to start, but after that I'd forget about it unless the 'issues' of rolling started to crop up, either because I'd have another one of my 18,18,18,17,16,12 characters (god I love my dice) or someone would have the opposite.
Now, if it was the only game available, and it was that or don't play, then I'd do it, but given the choice, roll.
Would you still go to a game using one of the other methods? How much would it hurt your interest?
I'll use any method as long as everybody is using the same method and the method suits the campaign. How good the DM and the other players are is a lot more important for my enjoyment then the character generation method.
By method suiting the campaign, I mean that even straight roll 3d6 6 times and write them down in the order you roll them can be fun with an old school campaign that suits it. But it would be a terrible way of generating characters for a 4e style campaign, where characters are supposed to start borderline super heroic and your expected to spend a lot of time developing the character concept.
Jay
Our group is generally very liberal in how we play. If we were playing with people we didn't know, however, we'd definitely go point-buy... no question.
We've already got a whole point buy vs. rolling debate raging in a different thread. I'd like to ask about something a little different here.
If you prefer one of:
A) Standard PHB point buy
B) Standard PHB arrays
C) Standard PHB rolling method
Would you still go to a game using one of the other methods? How much would it hurt your interest?
(There are so many possible homebrew variants that its difficult to consider them all, so let's try to stick to the official variants only).
Given those 3, I'd be happiest with point buy. I'd play a standard array without complaint. PHB rolls...er...well, that's two strikes against the game right there. Not only do I not like it, but I think that choosing that method tends to indicate a lack of general understanding of D&D 4e. That's not necessarily true, but its a big enough indicator to make me worry. I'd probably decline a random stat game.
What difference does it make how the characters are created?
Does it somehow become less fun if a different system is used?
I don't even understand the question.
Of course I'd play in a game if the character generation isn't my preferred method.
Why wouldn't I?
It's not about the character generation method. It's about who the character is (and the character is NOT his/her stats) and what the character does.
That said - although I haven't actually played in a rolled stat game in a decade I'm still kinda partial to rolled stats.
Hmm... A few years ago I worked out a hybrid system that allowed for rolled stats while still restricting the character to (more or less) buyable stats. Maybe I should start using that system*....
Carl
* The essence was that you rolled the dice for the first five values and calculated the cost of the roll, subtracting that from the total available point buy (note: the formula was extended down to accomodate values lower than eight). The value of the final ability was determined by the number of points left after accounting for the first five. Alternately, you could just declare that any roll lower than eight was treated as an eight if you didn't want to allow for very low stats.
There's really no difference between Point buy and Standard Array (at least in power). Just one allows you to min-max, or have more fine control. The other just gives you a constant spread.
I just want the characters to be on equal footing. I don't want a character left behind because he rolled poorly, or a character to upstage everyone because he got the greatest roll ever.
Since I'm usually the "low roller" in the group, I'd be the one to look to for an objection...
I much prefer point buy over rolled, although I will play with rolled stats - under protest and not without advocating point buy first. As long as I can build the character I want to play, I'll put up with it. (Although it would be a strong case to not join a completely new group).
I would absolutely play in a game that did not generate characters the way I prefer. But then again I don't really have much of a preference for stat generation as long as everyone does it the same way. If I had to pick a preference it would be based on the game type and mood really. Really I just like hanging out with my friends and having a good time, and stat generation really does not impact that in any way, shape, or form.
love,
malkav
I agree with malkav
I Mean it would depend on some of the rules that went with it.
After all ive seen far to many times a player get realy good stats / abilitys for his character BUT someone eles rolled crap. Thus why we swiched to point buy. That and you tend to get better stats in point buy.
I Mean the odds of rolling 4 14's Even (Which u can get with point buy along with other things) Is kinda low.
I Prever Pointbuy MUCH More. But yes i would still play in a dice rolling game so long as there was some simple rules.
1) You can reroll all your stats if your combined total Ability mods do not = up to 2-3 or higher (Meaning yes you have a 18 but then you have a 6/4/8/10/12 which is +4/+1/-1-2-3 = -1 Combined ability mod) Before race but allso make someone reroll if they got to good (But give them some bonus dice or something for getting good rolls) After all you dont want to out class eveyone eles and be the start and eveyone eles looks like dorks compared to you, After all if you got 18/18/16/12/10/10, Before race, Then by god I Love you. But compared to other people you might as well out shine them now and be done with it.
none of this 5d6 or 6d6 top 3 or 4d6 Reroll 1's and 2's Or **** like that eather that just proves to be realy high stats which can over power characters. Sure its nice but the campain will useoly last shorter
Yes i would still play but it depends on exactly how the dice was rolled.
2d6+6 isnt to bad eather It basicly 8-18 Stat so you cant have a 4 in something.
Would you still go to a game using one of the other methods? How much would it hurt your interest?
Yes, I'd still go to such a game. It would affect my interest but nowhere near enough by itself to alter my decision to participate.
How it would work, roughly, is you start with an array (I like 16,16,12,12,10,8). Now roll 1d6 to decide where that first 16 goes (1=Str, 2=Con, ...). Keep rolling until you've allocated each number.
Especially once we have the 4e PHB2 is there any allocation of that array that would be completely useless?
Especially once we have the 4e PHB2 is there any allocation of that array that would be completely useless?
The issue isn't always uselessness. Lets say I played a wizard last campaign and a cleric the campaign before and want to play a fighter this time since the 4E fighter looks really fun. Then I get Str 8 con 10 dex 12 int 12 wis 16 cha 16 using your methord. That could make a good cleric or a decent fey warlock or charisma paladin, but I do not get to be a fighter like I wanted. I guess I could play a fighter, but I would not qualify for many feats that I would want, would never hit anything, could not carry much equipment etc.
It isn't the balance alone that bothers me, but many rolling stats systems create characters based on chance and not based on what I want to play. Why should I have to limit myself to a character I do not want to play when I might spends months playing, when there is already a fully workable system in place that lets me create whatever I want to? And I try to play a lots of different classes. If I want to play a fighter this time let me have stats that work for a fighter.
What difference does it make how the characters are created?
Does it somehow become less fun if a different system is used?
Player A gets god stats and overshadows the rest of the PCs, especially player D, who got nothing over a 12 and is utterly useless because the game's math wants at least a 16 for primary attacking stats.
Yes, it makes a difference.
And before the 'well, the DM should get player D reroll', if you're just going to let people reroll until they get the stats they want ... give the point buy, then they *can* get the stats they want.
I'd just go with whatever method the campaign used, and consider it a challenge to come up with the most interesting and functional character possible.
I don't even understand the question.
Of course I'd play in a game if the character generation isn't my preferred method.
Why wouldn't I?
Your confusion is understandable; but you'd be surprised. In the original "Point-Buy versus Rolling" thread that StormKnight mentioned, some people have explicitly stated that, "If a game isn't going to use the ability score generation method I prefer, then I'll refuse to play."
Personally, I think such people are being ridiculous. I, for instance, have a strong preference for point-buy and believe that there are serious problems with rolling methods. Nonetheless, even I don't think those problems are so serious that I would refuse to join a game over them.
If my group was planning to roll ability scores I would probably try to dissuade them from it; but if, for some reason, they all insisted on rolling, I wouldn't quit the game over it.
Your confusion is understandable; but you'd be surprised. In the original "Point-Buy versus Rolling" thread that StormKnight mentioned, some people have explicitly stated that, "If a game isn't going to use the ability score generation method I prefer, then I'll refuse to play."
Personally, I think such people are being ridiculous. I, for instance, have a strong preference for point-buy and believe that there are serious problems with rolling methods. Nonetheless, even I don't think those problems are so serious that I would refuse to join a game over them.
If my group was planning to roll ability scores I would probably try to dissuade them from it; but if, for some reason, they all insisted on rolling, I wouldn't quit the game over it.
The compromise is, of course, to 'happen' to roll a 16, 14, 13, 12, 11 and 10.
Your confusion is understandable; but you'd be surprised. In the original "Point-Buy versus Rolling" thread that StormKnight mentioned, some people have explicitly stated that, "If a game isn't going to use the ability score generation method I prefer, then I'll refuse to play."
Personally, I think such people are being ridiculous. I, for instance, have a strong preference for point-buy and believe that there are serious problems with rolling methods. Nonetheless, even I don't think those problems are so serious that I would refuse to join a game over them.
If my group was planning to roll ability scores I would probably try to dissuade them from it; but if, for some reason, they all insisted on rolling, I wouldn't quit the game over it.
I haven't read the thread you mention, but I can say I can envision a few scenarios where such a person wouldn't be ridiculous. Basically, if the method used is reasonable, which includes not only the recommended ones in the PHB but any sort of homebrew system that gives a decent spread of stats without skewing too far toward towards any extremes, then yeah, a person who walks away just because it isn't their preferred method is just being a crybaby,
But if one were about to start a game and the method was really munchkiny (tending to consistantly produce either all high stats or some really really high stats and the rest really, really low) or really gimpy (i.e. Point buy but with only 10 points) I don't think it would be out of line to take that as a bad omen of things to come and say "no thanks"
Given those 3, I'd be happiest with point buy. I'd play a standard array without complaint. PHB rolls...er...well, that's two strikes against the game right there. Not only do I not like it, but I think that choosing that method tends to indicate a lack of general understanding of D&D 4e. That's not necessarily true, but its a big enough indicator to make me worry. I'd probably decline a random stat game.
I'm pretty much with you. If the game in question is an online game, I'd turn it down. If it's a live game though, I'd at least give it a try. If I roll really badly, I can always have my PC go suicidal so that I can roll up another. :D
TS
Its not like DMs actually seem to care much if you dump your 4 you got from a 4d6 minus worst roll. One game (my last of 3.5 in fact) the "social character" had a CHA of 5, which was disgustingly unfair because I had a CHA of 18 and diplomacy of +10 and bluff of +13 (at level 2 no less) and every time i tried to flagrantly lie and rolled above 30 the dm would be like "oh well bluff doesn't mean you can convince people of lies"... and I'm like duhh yes it does. Then I went and rewrote my character sheet because there would be no point in having high bluff.
That same game people meta'd constantly, to the point that they would yell "sense motive!" every time I had my character lie... and ALL of them would do it too - and then they would lose every roll because I would roll average 23 on my bluff and they would be lucky to get more than 10. Note that every time I said the truth they wouldn't try sensing motive.
long time GURPS and HERO player, where everything is points-buy
have played in games where one character rolled really good stats and overshadowed several people (I'm the strongest and the smartest and the quickest...)
have played in games where one person rolled really, really terribly and it made everyone feel badly about their success.
have played in games where someone had a real passion for a certain great concept, and was either completely thwarted, or totally neutered by dice rolling
have played in games where one person with good rolls completely overshadowed another character of the same "class" who rolled poorly (where a points buy system might have allowed them to differentiate themselves).
have played in games where someone rolled below their expectations and simply churned through characters (death, quits, retires) until they got a good one.
At this point, put me down in the "wouldn't play unless it was points-buy/array" category. I avoided one of my best friend's decade long gaming nights the entire decade because of his insistence on random stat generation. I'm not claiming I'm "in the right", but that's how I am.
To me, all of the modifications for rolling (4d6, outliers, etc.) all basically point to the fact that it sucks to be the guy who rolls lowest.
If its random, my group usually rolls stats first and THEN decides what kind of characters to make. It isnt a let down that way. Also, we arent too competitive so if one person rolled low, they wouldnt care. Any one of us who DM's would know how to keep the unlucky roller in contention and happy.
If its point buy, we pick our classes and go from there like everyone else.
I would play any game regardless of stat generation.
If its random, my group usually rolls stats first and THEN decides what kind of characters to make. It isnt a let down that way. Also, we arent too competitive so if one person rolled low, they wouldnt care. Any one of us who DM's would know how to keep the unlucky roller in contention and happy.
If its point buy, we pick our classes and go from there like everyone else.
It's not so much a matter of comparing one character to another, it's a matter of comparing the characters to the expected difficulty curve of the game. You need, typically, a 16 in your main attacking stat to be useful. If you don't pull a 16, you're going to get hosed.
I played a warlord with 14 STR (and 14 WIS and 14 CHA) and he did fine. It wasn't optimized but it was fun.
I would play in a game with any method of stat generation. I've played point-buy, a dozen bizarre types of rolling, and array games. It's never really made a difference. I don't care too much about the stat generation system.
In fact, I like the old natural system (roll stats in order) because it makes me try new things.
It's not so much a matter of comparing one character to another, it's a matter of comparing the characters to the expected difficulty curve of the game. You need, typically, a 16 in your main attacking stat to be useful. If you don't pull a 16, you're going to get hosed.
I guess its lucky no1 has rolled horribly bad in my experience where they dont at least get one 15-16 lol.
It's not so much a matter of comparing one character to another, it's a matter of comparing the characters to the expected difficulty curve of the game. You need, typically, a 16 in your main attacking stat to be useful. If you don't pull a 16, you're going to get hosed.
Only if you have a bad DM who doesn't know what s/he's doing. A half-decent DM knows how to set a game for any level of power (straight 18s or straight 8s, optimized or randomized)
Only if you have a bad DM who doesn't know what s/he's doing. A half-decent DM knows how to set a game for any level of power (straight 18s or straight 8s, optimized or randomized)
I'm sorry but an all 8 character doesn't work in 4th ED, and the only way to fix that character would be to give him better stats. It only works in 3rd ED and 2nd ED if you give the character a mass of magic items to boost his stats. Which is like using point buy but with a bigger chance that someone who doesn't understand the math screwing things up.
And so many people on the boards don't understand the math....
Only if you have a bad DM who doesn't know what s/he's doing. A half-decent DM knows how to set a game for any level of power (straight 18s or straight 8s, optimized or randomized)
Also, this response only really applies if the entire group of PCs is overpowered/underpowered to a similar degree. If the entire group is comparably above/below average, then it probably isn't too hard to adjust the difficulty of encounters to compensate for your overpowered/underpowered party.
The problem is that random methods rarely produce such uniform results. Instead, they usually result in a mix of outcomes, where some characters are significantly overpowered and others are significantly underpowered, all within the same group. In turn, you can't make the encounters harder for the powerful characters without punishing the weaker characters who are already behind the curve, and vice versa.
If the DM uses a decent point buy or a high value, then my suspicion goes away. He still has the opportunity of being Il Duce. I expect and am fine with tough opponents, but his giving a decent or high point buy might justify to himself to have uberoverlord monsters and bad guys to shove it down the players throats that their characters are not "all that". This can happen even with DMs who use dice rolling. It's an issue of DM jerkitude, not character creation method.
"Low" "Decent" and "High" point buy are subjective terms. Considering all of the character creation rules and level progression of 4E, while I'm not a fan of point buy I do consider 4E's 22 points system to be "decent". When I'm in a mood it's barely, but it's "decent" enough for me. For 3E, anything lower than 32 points is not "decent" for me. 28 points triggers DM can't stand powerful player characters. 25 points triggers DM afraid of powerful characters with a possible Il Duce complex instead. 22 points in 3E is goosestepping like crazy.
Only if you have a bad DM who doesn't know what s/he's doing. A half-decent DM knows how to set a game for any level of power (straight 18s or straight 8s, optimized or randomized)
Its not a matter of setting the power level of the game overall, its a matter of being the straight 8s guy in a party of straight 18s. EIther the power level is set for them (most likely scenario) and you get hosed or the power level is set for you in which case they are going to get bored. The only realistic alternative is for the DM to cheat in your favor. In which case it would have been easier to just let you have better stats to begin with, but if he does that it screws up the whole point of rolling vs point buy.
Why do I like rolling? It feels more organic and after a while of point buy, all the characters start looking the same. Sure there can be problems with rolling. Characters can be over/under powered, but that's why the DM should over see creation for rolling. Additionally, a good DM knows the balance and feel of the system well enough to make the right adjustments as needed. Play lean on the magic items, or toss in a few more than normal. Pad encounters properly. Whatever they deem fit and/or necessary. But like I said good DMs make all the difference.
I agree, it does not matter what system you use what so ever, it all comes down to having a DM who keeps the fun of the game in mind.
I love rolling, I feel dirty when I have complete control over what my character's stats are. When I DM I have a player role 4d6, drop the lowest, reroll 1s and then I give them a free 18, thats right, all my players get a free 18; their characters are the best of the best and my players get feel like they're on top of world but I don't let their characters walk all over me. If they roll too low I give em another chance if they roll too high I say good for you, its not big deal and I always make sure other players are not left behind.
I would play in any three setups, but not if the DM is too narrowminded to compromise with players who are looking for something else.
Only if you have a bad DM who doesn't know what s/he's doing. A half-decent DM knows how to set a game for any level of power (straight 18s or straight 8s, optimized or randomized)
What, the gimpy ogre goes after the guy with bad stats?
Standard array, Point buy, whatever.
Though I'm not fond of Gygaxian hard core. I.E. 3d6 rolled in order.
When I DM I have a player role 4d6, drop the lowest, reroll 1s and then I give them a free 18, thats right, all my players get a free 18; their characters are the best of the best and my players get feel like they're on top of world but I don't let their characters walk all over me. If they roll too low I give em another chance if they roll too high I say good for you, its not big deal and I always make sure other players are not left behind.
I'd roll with you. :D
Originally I was going to say that it wouldn't sway me, but after a few people pointed out extremes, yeah, those would sway me.
I'd be iffy with point-buy lower than 22 in 4e or anything lower than... what was the "normal" one in 3.5? 25?
3d6 in order would make me back away slowly.
Stat generation method would probably be a bigger factor if I was looking online for a game.
I think if I was going to play AD&D or older, I'd be much more accepting of using a crappy rolling method.
To the question of would I play? Yes, of course I would. I play this game to have fun. Doesn't every one? I mean, for the love of god, if that's not the case, why bother?
For me, the way in which my abilities are generated has nothing to do with the level of fun. If I had to roll and ended up with a gimped character because of poor luck, so be it. He'll die. Eventually. At that point I'll roll a new character. May the dice-gods bless him lest he end up another (eventually) dead gimp.
That said, as much as I loved rolling, I now prefer point buy because it places everyone on even ground from the start. Still, I wouldn't soil myself and cry like a little girl because I decided to play a game that used alternate stat generation.
~Bizkit
I've only given the thread a quick scan, so forgive anything that seems out of place with regards to my comments.
[[b][SIZE="4"]U]To the question of would I play? Yes, of course I would. I play this game to have fun. Doesn't every one? I mean, for the love of god, if that's not the case, why bother?[/SIZE][/b][/u]
For me, the way in which my abilities are generated has nothing to do with the level of fun. If I had to roll and ended up with a gimped character because of poor luck, so be it. He'll die. Eventually. At that point I'll roll a new character. May the dice-gods bless him lest he end up another (eventually) dead gimp.
That said, as much as I loved rolling, I now prefer point buy because it places everyone on even ground from the start. Still, I wouldn't soil myself and cry like a little girl because I decided to play a game that used alternate stat generation.
~Bizkit
EXACTLY.
Take care, friend.
Abilities have noting to do with the level of fun in the game. After all, I've played a 3.5e halfling barbarian with a riding dog. Short-lived campaign, but it was a blast.
arrays I dont like and have avoided and argued against if they come up in our group. they feel too generic, and the last time one of our group ran a game and wanted us to use an array, it was 13 12 11 10 9 8.
I wouldnt play in a game that didnt generate the way I prefer, and I didnt play in the above mentioned game with the array.
We always generate at the same time, no rerolls or 'warm up' rolls, and if we end up with some high stats here and there, its ok. we're playing heroes, after all.
(I usually get very very lucky with rolling. I had a char with 2 18s, 2 16s, a 12 and a 7)
We've already got a whole point buy vs. rolling debate raging in a different thread. I'd like to ask about something a little different here.
If you prefer one of:
A) Standard PHB point buy
B) Standard PHB arrays
C) Standard PHB rolling method
Would you still go to a game using one of the other methods? How much would it hurt your interest?
(There are so many possible homebrew variants that its difficult to consider them all, so let's try to stick to the official variants only).
Given those 3, I'd be happiest with point buy. I'd play a standard array without complaint. PHB rolls...er...well, that's two strikes against the game right there. Not only do I not like it, but I think that choosing that method tends to indicate a lack of general understanding of D&D 4e. That's not necessarily true, but its a big enough indicator to make me worry. I'd probably decline a random stat game.
None of the above in a 4th ed campaign, never again will I play in that edition.
I would have no problem with all of the above in any other edition though.
None of the above in a 4th ed campaign, never again will I play in that edition.
I would have no problem with all of the above in any other edition though.
That's nice, except it seems more like you're just bashing 4e than answering the question.
That's nice, except it seems more like you're just bashing 4e than answering the question.
Thats probably because I really hate 4th.
You did read my sig right?
That should have clued you in.
Thats probably because I really hate 4th.
You did read my sig right?
That should have clued you in.
Well, if we're just throwing out off topic posts to talk about what we hate, mosquitos suck. Both figuratively and literally.
On topic, point buy is preferred, standard array is acceptable, rolling is a negative.
None of the above in a 4th ed campaign, never again will I play in that edition.
I would have no problem with all of the above in any other edition though.
It's not that bad. It's like 3.5 if all the classes were Tome of Battle/Magic.
6d6, drop lowest 2, repeat for each stat
1's don't get a re-roll
you get to put the points where you want
I always end up with a reasonable to strong character with maybe 1 real weakness.
Otherwise I'd go for Point-buy which is boring as hell, but standard array is even worse.
So I would not play in a standard array game.
Thats probably because I really hate 4th.
You did read my sig right?
That should have clued you in.
If you hate it so much then stay out of the 4th Edition boards. Scroll down and you're in 3.5 land :D
- All ability dice rolls are at the table witnessed by other players and the DM
- Everyone uses the same set of dice
- 4d6 drop lowest, assign anywhere
I prefer rolling.
6d6, drop lowest 2, repeat for each stat
1's don't get a re-roll
you get to put the points where you want
I always end up with a reasonable to strong character with maybe 1 real weakness.
Otherwise I'd go for Point-buy which is boring as hell, but standard array is even worse.
So I would not play in a standard array game.
If you hate it so much then stay out of the 4th Edition boards. Scroll down and you're in 3.5 land :D
See i would run screaming from a game table with these generation rules...regardless of edition
I
If you hate it so much then stay out of the 4th Edition boards. Scroll down and you're in 3.5 land :D
Actually, this chunk of the boards is edition-neutral (hence its position between the 4e boards and the 3e boards). I made the same mistake myself.
Actually, this chunk of the boards is edition-neutral (hence its position between the 4e boards and the 3e boards). I made the same mistake myself.
Thanks Salla, alot of people don't seem to realize that this is the general D&D forum.
That's how we do rolls, I'd play with pretty much any non crazy type of generation.
all that being said have recently started playing in a group that just does standard point buy, and I'm having plenty of fun.
What's interesting about the above system is that in spite of the fact that i don't normally roll really high stats i've never felt underpowered because of it. I always built my character to the strengths i had and made them well rounded, overall useful members of the party. sometimes i get lucky and roll a 17 or 18, but i usually also have a couple stats at 13 or lower. works fine.
might be harder in 4e because the whole thing is set up for each class to fill a roll, with maybe a secondary roll, so statistically well rounded characters aren't what the game is made for, but it's a small enough difference that it's simple to overcome in my experience and that of most of my RP friends.